- cross-posted to:
- [email protected]
- cross-posted to:
- [email protected]
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Posting what I said on this in another thread-
So, this decision is really bad for reasons that go beyond sick workers. It’s really unpopular to mention but COVID isn’t over, it’s not gone. We just normalized the suffering and shunted the most vulnerable into its path. As one of those vulnerables still trying to survive, masking has been an exhausting situation. I mask, I have to, and antimask sentiment makes it hard to operate in a world that already wishes I wouldn’t. Decisions like this cause harm in wider ways. I wrote an email to In-N-Out Owner/President Lynsi Snyder about this in response to this policy. I don’t think she cares what this policy does, but I’m sharing here for others who may want to understand.
I’m writing to ask you to please reverse your recent decision to ban employees from wearing a mask unless medically exempt. This decision shows not only a complete disregard for the health and safety of your employees and customers, as everyone is affected by disease spread, but is also profoundly ableist and lacking an understanding of current (and historic) context. Requiring employees to not only divulge their medical information to their employers but also openly to the public is a mindset rooted in othering people who are disabled or otherwise medically vulnerable. In general, it’s bad when a marginalized group must publicly declare their status as such, but especially now when people are already struggling to survive an ongoing pandemic amidst the hostility of antimask sentiment. This decision furthers that othering and hostility, making those employees into targets. But this decision doesn’t just impact your employees directly, it feeds into that larger cultural antimask sentiment and perpetuates ableism. This lack of understanding of the impact of your decision is a clear message that it’s not just those employees your company does not value, but all disabled and vulnerable people. Please show your abity to learn and understand the impacts of your decision, as well as your disapproval of ableism, and reverse this decision. Further, I urge you to demonstrate actual value for your employees and customers by adapting to our reality and implementing measures to reduce the spread of covid and other pathogens in your restaurants and other workplaces. This can be achieved through simple measures like improving the ventilation and filtration in buildings, improving sick leave policies, and other actions including, yes, masking by employees.
Thank you Xxx
PS This company push to ignore our current reality and new cultural understanding of disease spread is not just callous, it’s boring. Be better.
We just normalized the suffering and shunted the most vulnerable into its path.
That isn’t what happened. We developed highly effective vaccines that keep you from dying and reduce your chance of serious illness and/or long covid. Hospitalizations for COVID have absolutely cratered faster than cases have. Like, the rule they made is fucking stupid, they deserve to eat shit over it, but you don’t have to completely mischaracterize what we did as a society in pushing back against employers being shitty to their employees.
COVID isn’t the only disease passed by aerosolized droplets. The availability of a COVID vaccine is irrelevant.
My feelings are this: if anyone feels like they should wear a mask, I absolutely want them to wear one. Whether that is for their risk from the public, or their risk to the public, if they think it’s needed, it is needed. Err on the side of caution.
Agreed, particularly on the point of want to wear mask, do so. Let’s take back what freedom means. Also, I work in vaccine development, primarily focused on respiratory diseases for oh these short 20 years. We all get all the recommended vaccines because we understand what that means. About 30% of us still wear masks, and are always allowed to join meetings online instead of in person.
I’m not mischaracterizing I’m illuminating an issue many have overlooked. Yes, the vaccines are effective against most variants at reducing serious illness and death for many. But they aren’t preventing infection or long term impacts from infection, have waning effectiveness, and there are many for whom they aren’t effective enough or at all (those vulnerables I mentioned). Many are still dying every week and last info we had showed in the US about half of those dying were vaccinated.
This part is mostly a rant- Covid (and others diseases) disrupts lives and can cause serious medical complications for many, yes even now. Those people’s needs have largely been ignored, now and before covid. We have a better understanding of how disease spread impacts everyone and how we can prevent it. We learned these lessons at the expense of millions of lives and instead of honoring that and implementing changes to better all our lives we’re squabbling over inefficient vaccines that many won’t take. I’m pro vaccines, but they’re currently not a solution to covid.
What if the vaccine isn’t effective with your body? You’re not allowed to protect yourself?
Of course you are.
CDC stopped reporting on covid in May. More people are dying from clogged arteries than covid right now.
And? People get sick from other airborne illnesses too, no person or company should ever be able to prevent someone from doing something to protect their body from injury. Banning masks, bathroom breaks, water breaks, etc, it’s all the same shit fucking sandwhich
Weird how nobody gave a shit about that before… hell nobody gives a shit about that now. I can count the number of people ive seen this month wearing a mask with 1 hand. I see hundreds of people a day and the only people that ive seen wearing masks wear it under their chin anyways. Tired of all this virtue signaling, nobody fucking cares
Yea, no one cares about disabled and vulnerable lives. That’s the point, that’s what we’re trying to convey. Thanks for clarifying for yourself.
Yes, nobody cares about disabled and vulnerables lives. So much that the only people that care are internet kids who say to boycott a place they probably dont even go to.
Why are you pro an environment in which your life isn’t valued, and so bothered by people who aren’t?
Im bothered that this is such a stupid thing to get your dick caught in a blender for. Its as stupid as boycotting a beer company for lgbt support or boycotting Twitter for having Elon as a CEO. Its all childish fugazi anger directed at pointless bullshit
Everyone should stop feeding this troll. Just add him to your block list and move on. He’s not worth your time or anger.
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Your being downvoted… but if we were actually worried about everyone’s health, we’d shut down all fast food and ban sugary sodas. Health only matters when it doesn’t affect the $$$ flow of the rich.
They’re being downvoted because it’s not a good comparison that’s relevant to this topic, it’s a distraction and a tired, oft repeated one to boot. Poor diet is not a communicable airborne disease.
Everyone here is getting their panties in a bunch about protecting people from covid when i could die just as easily from the flu. Nobody is making a case about wearing a mask because of the flu though, its about covid. Why are you guys trying to force this.
People smiled with their eyes so much more during the COVIDs.
It is obvious when someone with a mask on is smiling.
We have very elderly mothers, and sisters with cancer, so my family still masks. I smile at people all the time, they smile back, everyone goes away feeling good. I don’t understand how some people get so worked up over masks. 🤦♀️
The obvious take away is they dont want to see people smiling because they like seeing happy people.
They like to see smiles because it makes themselves happy to see smiles.
It’s ridiculously selfish even if you ignore that you’re putting everyone’s health at risk
As someone living on the East Coast who is never within 2,000 miles of an In n Out Burger, I’ll continue to do my part.
Love the In N Out double double, it’s tastier, and cheaper than McDonalds, but I won’t be going back to In N Out again, as forcing employees to be less comfortable and less safe in their working environment, one which necessitates them dealing literally face to face with a mostly uncaring unsafe unhealthy public is the line I draw in the sand. I still choose to wear my mask in public places like retail stores, because COVID is still very real. Everyone should be able to make their own choices, and stripping this right from an employee is not something I want to support with my patronage.
I still choose to wear my mask in public places like retail stores, because COVID is still very real.
I still wear a mask in stores, but it’s mainly because I don’t want to breath in whatever is flaking off the 400+ pound man in stained pajamas waddling around the Walmart. A lower chance of spreading or catching COVID is just gravy IMO.
I’m pretty sure masks don’t block most smells.
It won’t block the smell, but it will block most particulates coming off them. Like… if some of it flakes off, do you really want some what ever those suspicious stains on his pajama bottoms are in your lungs?
This is bassakwards. Forget covid, all cooks should be required to wear a mask while in a kitchen for the same reasons they’re wear hair nets and we have sneeze guards on salad bars. I don’t want some cook coughing on my burger.
Yeah exactly. Why more people haven’t taken COVID as an opportunity to learn that spitting germs out of your mouth on food is gross, is beyond me.
I agree at least for cooks, along the same lines as hand washing and hair nets. I’ve actually caught the flu from eating out before, you know those stomach flus that incubate really fast, you can tell. I’ve caught covid a couple times, but who knows how I got that, has a long incubation, no way to narrow it down. Anyway I don’t worry about covid any more than the flu. I almost died from the flu when I was a kid, never got that sick from covid, I mean it was still pretty nasty, but not life threatening.
Next they’ll be like …. No employees are allowed to wash their hands… hand washing is woke.
Killer strawman my dude. You must have strictly stayed inside for the last 3 years too huh
That… that’s not what a strawman is
Sooo it didnt oversimplify and attack something that wasnt in discussion. I think you should look up what a strawman argument is bubster
In N Out is okay. I’ll never understand the cult following this place has. It’s literally a case study in manufactured scarcity.
Same. Everyone used to rave about how good it was, but I always thought it was just average. Slightly better than the major fast food chains, but on-par with every local chain.
It was the standard for me. Not the best but certainly above the average. Didn’t care much for it until I moved to the east coast.
It’s like the Chick-Fil-A folks. Same cult, different chain.
Fuck you if your spouse or parents are going thru chemo, huh?
doctors note
Don’t eat out? It’s their responsibility to stay safe, not everybody else’s responsibility to keep them safe.
I meant, what if the in and out employee was living with someone immunocompromised.
Would that count? Should the employee be forced to tell an in and out manager that they are living with someone like that?Then don’t work a job that has you interacting with thousands of people a day. If you’re the only one wearing a mask it’s only keeping YOU from spreading what you already have and you shouldn’t be working anyway.
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These are the same type of people that whine about how “nobody wants to work these days!” Basically someone with zero integrity who will drastically change their so-called ‘strongly held beliefs’ to whatever suits them in the moment.
“I believe in freedom and want small government” “I support banning people from wearing masks and also banning specific types of medical treatments” “people need to work hard and support themselves” “people shouldn’t be working if they don’t want to get sick” “people should find a new job if they don’t like the one they have” “employees are so unreliable and don’t want to work these days. They keep quitting jobs!”
With all the mental gymnastics these people do day to day, you’d think they’d be a little bit sharper rather than just being mouthpieces for a handful of power-hungry individuals.
Don’t work a public facing job if you are contagious. Is this a new concept to you?
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DONT GO TO WORK SICK. If you work anywhere that actually cares about their employees or customers they don’t want you coming in and have sick days for it. I’m not saying to never go to work and live off some trust fund you idiot.
This is why we NEED worker’s unions. They can fight this corporate power bullshit.
I will fight the urge to drive 635 miles to my nearest In-N-Out because of this.
This doesn’t really seem like the right community to post this. Maybe try a news community, like [email protected]? (I think I linked that right)
Ribbit
It’s never going to be gone, specifically because of people like this.
Just like the flu never went away after the 1918 pandemic, again, because of people like to this.
They never really acknowledged it was here. I live near one of the Colorado locations and it has been (in)famous for COVID outbreaks the entire pandemic. And, for whatever obvious reasons, In-N-Out hasn’t had the same closures enforced on them that every other restaurant did. During an outbreak they’re supposed to close for a few days in our state, but they’re basically the only restaurant that has refused to close and has never faced repercussions out here. It’s maddening.
There’s TWO in colorado. One opened last year, the the other just opened in April.
More than that now, actually. There are two just in Colorado Springs and a bunch up in Denver Metro.
And yet the world still turns. Everybody else has just forgotten it, and dealt with it if they caught it. There’s lots of things in the world that are “sub optimal”. Deal with it.
People are dealing with it. By wearing masks
Yeah, they want to deal with it by wearing a mask but their company won’t let them.
Dude, getting caught in the rain without an umbrella = deal with it. Pretending there’s not still a pandemic is foolish.
This is a novel virus and we already suspect it’s fucking with people’s brains and hearts in ways we can’t detect. We have no idea what “long Covid” is really doing to people yet. For example, if you get chicken pox as a kid, you may get shingles as an adult.
For your sake I hope being flippant about this doesn’t come back to haunt you.
Just because everyone else has forgotten it doesn’t mean the aware just have to shrug and forget about it. The average person is ignorant AF
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Yeah. No real American would [blank]. And just because you think everybody wearing masks makes the country better doesn’t mean it’s a popular opinion. It’s been 2byears since everybody mostly stopped wearing masks because they vaccinated. Please come to the modern day. Most people fucking hated wearing masks.
Literally why?! This is so fuckin stupid.
Because The Covid is a lie.
But it was also created by the Leftist Cabal to cull the world!
It’s basically Schrodinger’s disease lol
I quit going there recently after reading that most of their meat comes from a place that is so bad it’s nicknamed Cowschwitz.
Its bad even getting close to Cowshwitz. The air is kind of green as you get close to it on the 5, all of a sudden you remember it’s there and try desperately to roll up windows or shut down the airflow in the car. In the end, it doesn’t help.
Is cowshwitz Harris Ranch? It smells bad on the way, but what’s wrong with it, I mean beyond whatever is wrong with any similar place?
I hadn’t really researched it; i was just turned off by the nickname. Actually Temple Grandin said they’re not bad to the animals, other than fattening and slaughtering, which is kinda their job.
I like In-N-Out’s food okay. What I really like is their simple menu. It’s the only fast food my family eats because they can do gluten free safely. The owners are definitely conservative and christian (and weirdly so imo) but those freaks know how to run a well-functioning restaurant. The mask ban is obviously stupid but I won’t boycott over it. Sucks for the workers, but also In-N-Out pays better and appears to treat their staff much better than your typical fast food joint. I’d hate to see those jobs shifted over to something like another McDonald’s, for example.
Five Guys is really good about allergens, including gluten. They have a special allergen free zone in the kitchen that is apparently a huge pain in the ass to prepare for use each time, but they make sure it’s not got any of what you’re avoiding. If you ask for something to be left out of your order they ask: “Allergy or preference?”
Five Guys? Good about allergens? I opened the door and was faced with a horror show. Peanuts to the left of me, peanuts to the right. Peanuts to the center. I retired from the field.
Yeah, idk… I went to their website and the fries are not flagged for peanut allergy yet it also says “cooked in 100% peanut oil” so that does not inspire confidence lmao
They aren’t exaggerating. There are literally pallets of peanuts just out in the open at Five Guys. It’s one of their things.
It’s probably 100% refined peanut oil, which removes the protein people are allergic to during the refinement process.
Interesting. I had no idea.
Yep peanut oil in the US is safe for people allergic to peanuts.
That’s good to know, thanks. I’ve never been to a Five Guys and I’ve heard mixed reviews. Some love it/some hate it. I hear they’re expensive? I will try them for safe GF.
Five guys is absolutely delicious…but they have peanuts in shells for free to snack on in the dining room so beware if you’re allergic.
