I guess this just goes to show what everyone is saying.
The left is shooting themselves in the foot. People care about immigration and the left won’t solve it. So they lose power, that’s democracy in action.
If the left want wants they need to listen to the concerns of the people.
Not that you’re wrong with your conclusion, but you picked a bad issue to go on. Democrats won’t solve immigration because there’s nothing to solve. Immigrants are not committing crimes at a higher rate than the rest of the population, and while America gets a lot of migrants, we also have a collapsing birthrate and need a growing populace for infinite shareholder growth.
The problem is that Republicans keep making up lies about immigration, even nonsensical lies like “they’re eating the dogs,” and the Democrats do nothing to dispel these lies. They don’t sit down with the charts that verifiably disprove the Republican bullshit. Instead, they pick it up, and promise they’ll be tougher on immigration next time, giving legitimacy to the lies.
Which aspects of immigration are harming you?
Lack of cultural integration, homophobia, sexism, racism, religion, lack of local training and development, lack of capital investment, high housing costs, poor housing quality, wage suppression, increasing density of the country, crime, making places less desirable and more crime ridden.
But no one ever wants to talk about anything that isn’t short term averages.
I haven’t got an issue with immigration as a concept or necessarily as an average.
But there is a reason no one complains about first, second, third generation Australians coming to their country not learning the language, not integrating, committing crimes and no treating women right. A lot of people on the left live in outright denial about immigration.
Sure keep the upper class happy by keeping wages down and house prices high. Only costs you money, safety and community.
People care about their economic well-being (which “the immigrants” are just scapegoats for) and the liberals abjectly refuse to do anything about that.
But that still doesn’t excuse anybody flushing the rule of law down the toilet.
racism should be represented across the board
Economy? Ah yes, let’s elect the person that wants to put 100% sanctions on literally everything. Masterful gambit sirs. Ya’ll can rot in hell!
Also side note, America’s economy is held up by cheap immigrant labor, so way to double dunk.
Also, I love how no one gives a shit about the ecological apocalypse. This is why I kept telling you guys: let the hurricanes destroy everything. No more FEMA. Americans clearly don’t care.
Racism less important, immigration more important… that’s interesting…
I think we have to accept that the American electorate actually wants fascism.
It’s more that Harris did such a terrible job that even the other side being literal Hitler didn’t save her.
Bro, in don’t care how bad Harris is/was. If you prefer trump to her, it’s on you.
As always, mathematically not voting is equivalent to voting for the winner, since it’s a vote that didn’t change the result. So yeah. The above statement rings true.
As easy as it is to blame voters, the American electorate didn’t want fascism. That’s just false. Harris dug her own grave by actively discouraging voters who didn’t want fascism. This electorate is the same one that elected Biden in 2020 and (mostly) the same one that elected Obama in 2008 and 2012. They just wanted a real candidate and Harris wasn’t that.
Let’s give them leftist fascism and see how they react.
Leftist fascism is called communism.
Leftist fascism is called fascism, because the term leftist doesn’t actually mean anything but fascism and communism do.
They elected the candidate backed by Russia, which is still the shining beacon of a global superpower for the Tankies out there. So I guess Trump is a perfectly fine representative of fascism, left or right.
Blame the news media. They sane washed Trump.
Nah they wouldn’t shut up about him til the point it got numb. Maybe they should have focused on Kamala instead.
Another thing that’s barely on the chart: Foreign Policy, some fraction of which would be the genocide.
It just wasn’t the influential issue that much of Lemmy wished it were, and clearly not the reason Harris lost.
99.9% of US voters wouldn’t even be there if it wasn’t for genocide
Exactly. For all the talk of the Palestine/Israel genocide being a reason people didn’t vote Harris, this poll certainly makes it seem like less of the issue. What the fuck happened? I’m genuinely ashamed to live in the States.
What the fuck happened?
Four years of a milquetoast, centrist Democrat telling the American people what they’re living isn’t the actual reality of the situation. Biden’s admin kept rolling out the “soft landing, economy is doing great,” schtick despite numerous news outlets reporting Americans don’t feel like it’s an economy working for them.
Then that Democrat finally stepping aside, too late for his constituents to have a say in who they want representing them. And then she ran on a centrist, return-to-the-status-quo platform that didn’t inspire the majority of Americans, who are so apathetic based on decades of being ignored by politicians they just don’t vote. Because what’s the point?
Foreign policy isn’t important to the workers, doing political work in my local area people will sooner talk about the dog shit sproon around theyre street or litter, the closure of public toilets or the removal of public bins as they all have a noticeable and tangible effect on day to day life. Sadly Gaza isn’t a broad issue to none gazans. I’m not advocating for this behaviour btw, just pointing out what I’ve noticed and spoken about in political circles.
Remember that people who considered foreign policy (aka Gaza) to be the most important didn’t vote. People who voted Harris did so because they either thought some other issue was more important or just didn’t care. I think you’ll get better insights from a “why didn’t you vote” survey. That said it’s definitely not the only reason Harris lost; it was her complete and utter failure at campaigning that allowed Trump to go around collecting swing states like they’re fucking MTG cards.
People who voted Harris did so because they either thought some other issue was more important or just didn’t care.
Or realized that Trump would be far worse for the Palestinians than any Democrat has ever been.
People keep saying this, but misunderstand why people didn’t vote for Harris over Gaza.
It doesn’t matter if Trump is worse. People don’t want the Democrats to think this behavior is OK.
Worse maybe, but not for worse. That said that’s not really what I’m trying to say; my point is that people whose number one issue was Palestine overwhelmingly didn’t vote. Democrats went to vote despite Biden/Harris’s Israel policy, meaning they considered something else to be more important and so they wouldn’t answer this poll with “foreign policy”.
I love how Economy is a high priority, yet they voted for the asshole known being the genius behind several bankruptcies. “The economy isn’t doing good, clearly we need someone who can fuck shit up to make it work!”
Unironically, I think that was the thought process.
Hard to vote for someone who is telling you all is well and the people that got the country here are competent and mean well, when the country is going through 5 different crises, all preventing you from living a decent life.
Exactly. Harris was tasked with defending and indefensible record. It’s that simple.
She didn’t have to defend it. This was an election to run over Biden until he was just a pile of goo. She could have came out with some strong contrasting policies, instead she gave some great sound bytes for Trump.
It was such an easy lay-up to fumble. Hell, she raised millions in personal donations compared to a Trump campaign that ended up stiffing locations on payment because they’re so broke, it was the rare election where the Dems didn’t need their corporate donors. They could have accepted some long-term financial losses in the face of potential greater long-term gains if they could maintain similar levels of personal donations from energized progressives. I remember the energy in the air when Harris/Walz was revealed, it seemed like a progressive ticket could seriously exist.
And then it all vanished. Thanks for taking my $20, assholes. Wouldn’t have bothered if I knew they’d just dance to their owners demands anyway.
Fumbling what should have been a cupcake question to talk about a major campaign promise is inexcusable.
The American electorate:
I would assume the answer to your question is “this data sucks”
Or Nuclear arsenel. The reason is that it wasn’t mentioned at the debates.
You don’t win an election just with vibes.
Kamala didn’t bring as much substance as what the left electorate was expecting from her, and couldn’t differentiate herself from Biden and the current term she is serving under. The whole democratic party went under because all they promise is vibes compared the current economical struggles people are facing.
I was onboard with her but I honestly felt icky every time the Biden administration released a new statement about how good the economy is. How out of touch do you have to be to think the economy is good? Republicans have no intention of fixing that but at least they’re smart enough to see that people feel crushed in this economy and pander to it. And apparently that was a much bigger issue than abortion, which shocked me at first but as it settles I see that my fear as a woman pales in comparison to America’s fear of a woman and America’s struggling financial situation.
How out of touch do you have to be to think the economy is good?
Liberals measure the health of the economy by Gross Domestic Product (which has been going up), and Consumer Price Index (which includes big-screen TVs). You’d have to dismantle everything they paid to learn in college econ.
“It’s easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled.”
The truth is the dems are a right wing party now, they’ve been dragged there by the rethugs… and people Want to vote for an Actual left wing party, but there literally isnt one in the US.
I don’t think people want to vote for a party. People want to vote for someone who’s making sense for them, and looks like for majority it was Trump this time.
An “actual left wing party” must not only have ideology, but a sound plan on how to improve people’s lives and an ability to communicate this plan to people, loud and clear. Actually, as populists are now trusted everywhere in the world, the plan is less important than communication
trumps ‘road to prosperity’ is tariffs… which will lead to a depression, maybe a global one. Thats a helluva plan there
I didn’t read that as OP saying they believed that will work, I read it as saying the majority of Americans (or at least the majority of Americans who bothered voting) believed that.
The dems were never left wing in international standards. otherwise you would already have had universal health care.
The poison of the “big tent”. Move a little over to let people in enough and you are no longer representing anyone in a desperate attempt to represent everyone.
between this and the enshittification of big tech and gaming, it feels like 2024 has been one big argument in support of gatekeeping.
Or you know, not gatekeeping but actually taking a position as a political party (instead of trying to be some grey nothing). Oh and having more then two parties would be nice.
Because too many people are selfish and think that things are bad so might as well make them worse.
Economy
This is Trump’s economy, you idiots. This is the fallout from his incompetence and malice. But heaven forbid voters understand basic principles which rule their lives.
No, sorry, but you don’t get to say that four years later.
The economy got trashed in his last year… but remember how the sparse economic relief that were carried through the democratic congress got completely wiped out as soon as Biden took office? When the democrats took away the child tax credit childhood poverty doubled overnight. And you may say the cause of the inflation was Trump’s mismanagement (And it wasn’t. The supply chain breakdown would have happened no matter who was in office.) what was the democratic response? Fucking Chicago school.
What’s happening is the US empire is not so slowly rotting and material conditions are deteriorating. That’s independent of what party is in power. But both parties are wedded to capital. And voters are hopping from one foot to the other while standing on that hot skillet trying to find relief. You’re not going to find it without overthrowing capitalism. This is the barbarism we were warning you about.
That’s the advantage of the 2 party system. There is no other way out except revolution. In most European countries there is still an irrational but valid hope for regular reform through regular political means. Those countries are fated to linger on like this a little longer.
How can hope be both irrational and valid?
When it’s based on emotions or tradition. “We’re too big to fail” or “We’re the best, so we’ll get there”. Those are good motivators, but completely unbased
And it wasn’t. The supply chain breakdown would have happened no matter who was in office
if i remember correctly, COVID brought our inflation up to roughly 6%. then the Ukrainian war took it the rest of way where it peaked near 9% (over 10% in my home state)
these things would have happened anyway, although choosing to prolong the Ukrainian war as long as possible most definitely increased inflation. people think we only gave 2 or 3 hundred billion, but realistically the American public has paid more than a trillion in the invisible tax that is inflation. hundreds of thousands of layoffs because of higher interest rates are also connected to this
Let’s not forget that a large part of the inflation, and especially on food and housing, was driven by pure greed and opportunism from the capitalists that control those basic necessities. And that’s something that could have been prevented with tools that capital permitted under Ronald Fucking Reagan.
it’s an eternal battle. every once in a while we pass legislation to try and reign in corporate power. like for example the anti trust act in the early 1900s
the issue is that public attention is temporary. eventually we move on to the next crisis and people forget. grow complacent.
corporate interest, however, is eternal. it’s persistent and never gives up. it keeps pushing, infallibly, in order to weaken the structures meant to reign in their power. whether by legislation/policy (AT&T and friends unilaterally killing Net Neutrality some years back, Disney signing into law expansion of copyright, etc) or through more subtle methods (buying politicians and getting people into positions of power that have no intention of enforcing the laws)
this is inevitably what happens with every democracy. eventually the vigilance fails and the structures of power are hijacked by opportunists.
although having said all that, I don’t think greed had much to do with the inflation we saw. Sure, some companies took advantage and raised prices more than they needed to just to inflate that extra juicy profit margin.
but realistically we’re headed to war and war means massive government spending which means inflation
You’re separating government from the capitalists and I don’t think that’s an accurate way of looking at the world. Capital will eat itself even more voraciously than it does right now without some mediating force on itself. Government isn’t a hedge against capitalism that mediates its excesses. It is a PART of capitalism that mediates its excesses. The anti-trust act wasn’t for us; it was for them.
But the reality that capitalism is a fundamentally unstable system can’t be fixed by blunting it. And as the rate of profit goes down, the very restraints that capital put on itself to ensure its survival must be destroyed in pursuit of that profit.
i think most legislation is explicitly for the capitalist class. that much we probably agree with
but i do think every once in a while, when there is a ton of pressure and the elites are scared, they throw a bone to the working class.
it happened with the antitrust act, it happened with the New Deal, and it happened in the 1960s with the Civil Rights era and the end to Vietnam
yes, capitalism will eat itself. it’s what we’re essentially seeing right now in slow motion. but there is something there in democracy beyond just capitalism. even if it’s buried deep down and impotent
it happened with the antitrust act, it happened with the New Deal, and it happened in the 1960s with the Civil Rights era and the end to Vietnam
The thing that ties all of these exceptions together is the immediate threat of ideologically organized revolutionary cadres mobilizing the masses into a socialist revolution
i think you give too much credit to Trump. the economy has been rigged against the working class for a long time. it’s just getting progressively more brutal which makes people feel increasingly insecure.
an insecure working class elects strongmen who promise simple solutions
The best, simplest summation I’ve seen. Thank you. I’ve been searching for something to make sense of it and this is definitely it. Being forced into voting for the “least worst” candidate obscures where that path is headed by either candidate.
It’s the pattern in American politics that has existed since I was born: Republicans fuck the economy, Democrats do their best to fix it, people blame the Democrats for the bad economy and elect Republicans who fuck it up even more.
Worse: Congress purposely intended for the president to not have direct control over the economy.
Honestly, I hope Trump and his republican dumb fucks go through with their tariff plan to “save” the much improved economy. Americans deserve it.
I wanted Bernie some years ago but also believe that we deserve this.
Americans deserve everything that is about to happen.
I feel kinda sad for them.
Feel bad for the rest of the world who still rely on the unreliable American voters.
Eh. Russia doesn’t rely on American voters. We know Putin will draw 80% votes with 80% turnover.
You should. Our country was just flushed down the drain by 37% of the voters who are all a bunch of dumbfuck morons.
Don’t disagree and I honestly hope all of their promises come true this time, abortion restrictions at the federal level, the gutting of government, putting Herschel Walker as the head of the DoD, all of it.
Americans will never learn unless they suffer.
As an American, you’re right. I guess Trump won’t see consequences, but maybe the country will. And MAYBE voters / non voters will learn something.
I guess Trump won’t see consequences,
Probably not given his age, diet, and general level of fitness.
And even if he does live that long, I doubt he will remember it given his clearly declining mental health.
The problem is the consequences are not immediate. This is like making a child sit in their room because they scribbled on the wall in crayon last week. They don’t have the capacity to make that connection.
If renewed inflation takes another four years to really build up, guess whose fault that becomes? If the climate gets worse over years, decades, generations, no blame here. If Russia invades the Baltic states after consolidating Ukraine, it couldn’t be due to appeasement here. If they succeed in replacing the merit-based civil service with partisan hacks whose only skill is “loyalty”, clearly it’s the swamp that needs to be drained.
As a german i can tell you that the learning effect doesn’t last forever either
Obviously. It didn’t even last 4 years for us…
TIL that trump is Leto Atreides II
Trump isn’t even 10% as competent as Leto Altreides II.
