Yikes.
This is a reminder to lemmy users, that this new meta expriement will use the ActivityPub protocol, meaning that it can interact with other lemmy instances, please urge your lemmy instance admins to de-federate from this crap as soon as it launches!
But why? Isn’t the whole point of federation that we can interact with people in other communities? Don’t we want these big platforms to adopt ActivityPub? Completely walling them off seems counterproductive
Not defending Meta, just curious
there is a very good chance that this project by meta is the thin end of the wedge
(edited to include “the blogpost”, link here)
Interesting and I’d say you’re right. If you were to see a mass adoption of the fediverse (such as Twitter imploding and mastadon becoming the replacement) there would be an immediate attempt by the big tech players to gain control of it in some way. And this is exactly how they would try to do it.
Also here is a blog post about how Google killed the Extensible Messaging and Presence Protocol (XMPP) using extend, embrace, extinguish.
What’s the alternative? They go with a non activity pub system and woo away all our users anyway?
If people want to crawl back into Meta’s clutches I’m not going to stop them. Don’t give the one nice thing we have to a corporation that only wants to exploit us.
Are you telling me this perfectly human looking human shouldn’t be trusted?
realistically, yes :(
opinion time: not everything has to be about fast/unsustainable growth, in the pursuit of profit. i would prefer that the fediverse grows organically, and entices quality users, posters and commenters to join based on the merits of the service, and not on it’s access to inflated VC budgets, huge advertising campaigns, and exploitation of a first-mover advantage.
facebook/meta will slay us, because we are a threat to it’s profit model. why are we even contemplating negotiations with a tiger while we have our head in it’s mouth? it beggars belief…
I feel like there’s no winning if you’re a dev at one of these companies. Go with a centralized protocol, you get shit for creating a walled garden. Take part in federation, and people give you shit for that too. I think it’s genuinely amazing that we are seeing engineers that have made some of the most fundamental software that the internet runs on dip their toes into federation.
Who cares? I’d rather they stay away from here anyways.
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Is there a fediverse version of Facebook?
Very roughly,
Lemmy and Kbin = Reddit
Masterson = TwitterSo what equals Facebook
Friendica
Presumably Facebook’s move into ActivityPub is to prevent or limit users moving to a decentralised alternative to Facebook?
I think Diaspora* is the federated FB alternative
There was also a crypto backed and “freeze peach absolutist” alternative, Minds, dunno how that one’s going
Oh jeez Someone wanting more free speech than Facebook yikes
Diaspora as said was it long ago. Nowadays I guess the Movim project based on xmpp can give and experience similar to it.
Diaspora as said was it long ago. Nowadays I guess the Movim project based on xmpp can give and experience similar to it.
Diaspora as said was it long ago. Nowadays I guess the Movim project based on xmpp can give and experience similar to it.
Presumably Facebook’s move into ActivityPub is to prevent or limit users moving to a decentralised alternative to Facebook?
Don’t we want these big platforms to adopt ActivityPub?
No. We don’t. The more hands they have in the fediverse pie, the more influence they have over it. The more influence they have, the more control. The more control, the more at the whim of their decisions you are. The more at the whim of their decisions, the more power they have over you.
This should be common sense at this point.
Don’t we want these big platforms to adopt ActivityPub?
I certainly don’t. I abandoned Facebook years ago because of how BS they were getting with privacy concerns and social manipulation. Last thing I want is to bring those dumpster fires here. They join the platform, I will migrate to whichever Instances defed them or leave Lemmy entirely if necessary. Simply put, it’s been a breathe of rational, civil air here. While it is early days keeping that hostile-to-humanity crap out of here is obvious minimum we should be doing.
Were talking about meta here, this is a bait and switch attempt (I see it that way)
They launch their new twitter competitor, everyone moves over to their new twitter clone, they will try and hold the power on standarts of federation (like any big tech corporation that has a smaller rival that succedes more then them, see microsoft vs netscape for refrence)
If they will fail with that, they will try to seduce lemmy and mastodon instaces with monetization and big money handouts, were talking about facebook here after all, they are not short of scummy tactics
Don’t we want these big platforms to adopt ActivityPub?
No. We don’t. The more hands they have in the fediverse pie, the more influence they have over it. The more influence they have, the more control. The more control, the more at the whim of their decisions you are. The more at the whim of their decisions, the more power they have over you.
This should be common sense at this point.
If they can embrace and extend the fediverse you know they’re gonna extinguish it, too. They’re s bad faith actor, we don’t want them interacting with us or influencing us.
I’m don’t know how the federation protocol works exactly, but I’m pretty sure Meta can throw more resources into it than all the independent instances combined. Again, I don’t know anything about the specifics of the fediverse so I don’t know if that applies here, but generally once you control more than 50% of something that does not have a central authority - you became, de facto, that central authority.
What decade are you from, dude?
We want individuals to adopt ActivityPub. Whether that be in the form of hosting new instances or contributing content. We don’t want corporations here trying to turn it into something they can use to make a profit.
Another really big concern I have is that activity pub by definition shares all your posts with any instance that hosts your followers. So if you have a mastodon follower on FB’s activity pub/twitter replica, FB automatically gets your data even though you don’t use it
The type of things they get are
- Your profile
- Whatever you post
- Who interacts with your posts
Another really big concern I have is that activity pub by definition shares all your posts with any instance that hosts your followers. So if you have a mastodon follower on FB’s activity pub/twitter replica, FB automatically gets your data even though you don’t use it
but homeboy wanting to open the fediverse to Meta really still out here like "oh, there’s nothing malicious here, not at all; water’s fine"
I don’t understand why people call Facebook Meta now
I don’t accept that name
It’s Facebook
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If we’re going to cast the Zuck as a sci-fi android, I’d put him as closer to Isaac (The Orville) than Data.
He may want to consume data about human interactions, but you know he’s going to pepper any conversation with the phrase “inferior biologicals.”
There he stood… Between us and the alley. Zuck Farkus staring out at us with his yellow eyes. He had yellow eyes! So help me God, yellow eyes!
Bro looks like he got long covid
“Zuck: Yeah so if you ever need info about anyone at Harvard
Zuck: Just ask.
Zuck: I have over 4,000 emails, pictures, addresses, SNS
[Redacted Friend’s Name]: What? How’d you manage that one?
Zuck: People just submitted it.
Zuck: I don’t know why.
Zuck: They “trust me”
Zuck: Dumb fucks.“
How the fuck did Harvard students act so stupid and give out their info like that? I thought they were like the smartest people in the US. 🤔
Most Harvard students are still just 18-22 year old “kids”. Think of how dumb/naive you were at that age.
Try telling that to a 18-22 yr old. You think you know everything at that age. Then you get older and realize no one knows any fucking thing
To be fair, when you’re at that age and come into contact with dozens of “adults” that never mentally grew past 12, you’re bound to think you’re “very smart”.
Yea except I know I know everything so I’m built different
There’s a reason second-year students are called sophomores. It’s a compound with the same roots as “sophisticated” and “moron”. It literally means “learned idiot”. It’s referring to the students who have a year of schooling under their belt, and think that they understand everything about the world. It’s basically referring to the Dunning-Krueger Effect, where people who know very little about something are the most likely to overestimate their knowledge on the topic.
As a 21 year old I would be offended but then I remember I just admitted my exact age on the internet
Oh don’t worry, I’m still in that age range, I guess I’ll find out how dumb I am in a few years from now. 😅
You don’t get any smarter, just wise enough to know how dumb you are.
Maybe.
If you’re lucky
Nah, it’s just the kids of the wealthiest people and a handful of diversity admissions.
smartest people in the US
The problem is that that is a very low bar to overcome
This is still I think the most telling glimpse into who the “ZUCK” really is. Looking at what meta has become, how it has operated… No matter how professional and respectable he acts.
This is who he really is.
I don’t it’s a fair assessment - dude was just a kid.
I’ve watched some podcasts and interviews and I think he’s a much more complex of a person. I do genuinely think he’s thinks he’s doing good and I do think that Meta stuff is a net benefit to the humanity.
Even if you hate Facebook it brought people together in so many places, especially if you consider developing world.
Doing good does not absolve you of having done evil.
Zuck has utterly failed in preventing facebook from doing clear, preventable, harm.
I don’t get to walk free, no matter how many homeless people I feed, if I kill one.
The same should go for corporations. If they do evil, once, they should done. Not fined. There is no math which makes the bad that facebook does, necessary to achieve the good it does.
The same should go for corporations. If they do evil, once, they should done.
You kinda just gutted 99% of corporations. And done overall nothing for society because they already all reopened under different names.
Why are you assuming the legal framework for ending corporations couldn’t have mechanisms to prevent that?
For example, offending corporations could be broken up, and have their assets sold to their competitors. The resulting money used as severance for the employees, who didn’t necessarily do anything wrong.
A company can’t just “start back up” if you take all their capital. And no-one would re-invest in people known for taking legal risks that might make that investment go “poof”.
And 99% of corporations wouldn’t be evil if it wasn’t fucking legal, and basically required to compete!
I don’t think it’s even legal to give away a company’s assets without their consent, be they criminal or not.
And anyway, that’s easy to get around that too. Full of companies that already “”“go bankrupt”“” to avoid paying their due and then reopen with money magically appearing from “somewhere”. In the end to me it just seems the more rules/laws you add, the more the average person will suffer because of it while not really causing any for assholes.
“This thing would be illegal” is a pretty shit argument when changing the law is on the table.
And I see you’re a fan “anti-regulation” ideals. Did it occur to you that this system could entirely replace a shitload of micro-managing bs current regulation? And did you miss the part where re-investment in criminals wouldn’t be a thing it was that expensive? The only reason it happens right now is because it technically legal, and cheap.
That’s why limited liability is bullshit. You make the decisions, you go to prison for the crimes that come of them.
It’s kind of a gray area though. Do you just jail the CEO if a company does evil? What if it was someone else inside the company and the CEO didn’t know? And conversely, what if the CEO knew and is trying to pass off like they didn’t, how do you prove it? It turns into slippery slopes pretty fast.
My personal solution would be just to actually scale up the fines. If someone gets fined for something they profited from, it’s extremely stupid for the fine to be less than their profit. You’re basically telling them to do it again.
I mean, aren’t CEOs massive pay justified because they supposedly take on ultimate responsibility for the company?
If a company does something criminal under their watch, then even if they didn’t give the orders they have been criminally negligent - surely?
Now, mind, I don’t think that they should necessarily be the person punished most - the person’s down the chain more responsible should serve more time. But the person at the top shouldn’t get away free.
Regardless though I agree - fines with teeth are the most important thing.
I mean, aren’t CEOs massive pay justified because they supposedly take on ultimate responsibility for the company?
If a company does something criminal under their watch, then even if they didn’t give the orders they have been criminally negligent - surely?
Now, mind, I don’t think that they should necessarily be the person punished most - the person’s down the chain more responsible should serve more time. But the person at the top shouldn’t get away free.
Regardless though I agree - fines with teeth are the most important thing.
Have you watched ‘The Social Dilemma’?
Facebook actively promotes things that will make you scared and angry, because those are the emotions that drive the most engagement and get the most clicks.
I do genuinely think he’s thinks he’s doing good and I do think that Meta stuff is a net benefit to the humanity.
The problem I see is that you’ve bought into his lie. He might “sound” genuine in thinking he’s done good, much like Bill Gates sounds genuine when he talks about his philantropic shenanigans. It’s all an act.
The only net benefit I see off FB/Meta is that it taught us how dangerous and shitty a centralized internet is.
Woah! How is this real?
Don’t forget to report it inside Play Store. All of these permissions are not required, thus the app is breaking store rules.
Instagram has all the same stuff and it’s been there for years. Bet it’s also the case with Facebook
It’s meta. Unfortunately I’m sure their lawyers can come up with dumb bullshit excuses for every one of these.
They’re not permissions, they’re the types of data that may be collected. Every popular closed source app has a similar obscene list of private data they may collect, but in most cases it’s the user that chooses to provide that kind of information voluntarily anyways.
What do you mean its not requierd, but then how will meta sell your data and make billions?/s
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Isn’t that just…everything?
Like is there anything they aren’t requesting?
The user interface to display what is granted by using the app is… so sanitary. It disguises the ultimate goal of these insidious apps in such a clean and sterile list that it really seems innocuous. I wish that A$pple would start to display an intensity of how much data is collected by these apps. Green for good, red for bad, gradient for in-between. Or something… I suppose that accessibility for colorblind is important oto. Then it would be a bit more obvious to users when an app is really out to get them vs trying to improve performance.
How clean your bedroom is.
For now, anyway.
Data this app collects: yes.
“other data”
Honestly, anyone who willingly uses any Facebook product at this point in time deserves to have their every morsel of data stolen and sold to the highest bidder.
If you sleep with dogs, you wake up with fleas.
I bet they said something like “we don’t use most of that information, we just need access in case we add a new feature in the future that uses it”. And then it’ll come out that they’ve always been using it, and it’s been associated with your identifying info. And then their server will be hacked (because the admin password was “meta123”) and the all the info will leak. The modern internet sucks.
I’m asking myself how people can accept these conditions. There is a huge work of education on privacy to be done.
Do not trust apps like this. Facebook mined this shit without any warning originally.
jUsT gIvE mETa A cHAnCe iN tHe fEdIVeRsE DuRRrrpH
Meta rolling into the fediverse like the martians in Mars Attacks.
“Don’t run! We’re you’re your friends!”
I have heard this in Zucc’s voice and it still made total sense.
That’s it, now we’re gonna have to break out the Slim Whitman!
(cues Indian Love Call)
Lol not sure why people are surprised
Zuck wants to know your location
Anyone know Meta’s track record with data?
It’s got to be great if they ask for all this /s
so what is the difference from Spyware and meta’s services
Nothing. As is the case with most social media companies, you are the product. And they do that by spying on you. Same with many other “free” services like, YouTube, email, maps, etc.
well that’s make my cybersecurity lesson about spyware irrelevant in this environment, because every Free services are leeches for our information. but the justification for including spyware is where the data is going, and yet again very irrelevant.
Well if you download a Facebook owned app you should expect this.
