Fortunately, this fucking windows partition I only keep for VR with my shitty Oculus Rift CV1 reminds me how fucked up the alternative is. I can’t fucking wait to get a Steam Frame and ditch it.
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The only thing reading something like this does for me is paint the linux community as completely inept and dishonest.
I swapped GPU in windows by downloading the new driver, shut down the pc, swap cards, boot pc that then loads a default windows driver, install the new driver I downloaded, done. If it asks for a reboot, that takes another 20 seconds.
Done.
This is, specifically, the workflow for changing graphics cards manufacturers on windows, e.g. nVidia to AMD. If you’re just going from one AMD card to another, or vice versa, generally you can just toss it in and reboot a few times, yes.
GPU manufacturers are fucking awful about actually uninstalling their bloatware shit on windows, and it often (potentially intentionally) interferes with other manufacturer’s drivers (and sometimes their own, though that’s less common these days.)
Windows Update installed the bare driver for both Green and Red GPUs directly. There’s no additional software needed for either unless you plan to adjust clock and memory speeds or want something specific from the vendor’s software.
I agree that the original post is dishonest, but your solution is exactly the same as what they said with the exception that you knew it would be a problem so you downloaded the driver beforehand. Had you not known that would happen the series of misfortunes could have happened to you too.
I didn’t come here to complain about linux, but the number of distros that give me a black screen after some hardware change or update is more than I can count on two hands. What this post is denying that both userbases have wildly different skill levels because linux generally requires a higher skill level. Windows is over a much more massive userbase that includes people who can’t set the time display on a microwave. And they don’t use linux.
Furthermore, pre-downloading the driver is completely unnecessary as the default windows driver would allow you to continue using the PC and download the correct driver after installation. No “series of misfortunes.”
Can you give me an example of which distro/hardware change gave you a black screen? Because unless it was Gentoo or something you built the kernel yourself a black screen is extremely unlikely. Unlike Windows which requires drivers for everything, in Linux the drivers are baked into the kernel, so any hardware change should just work out of the box (there are some caveats to get the best possible driver, but even the included driver should be more than enough for almost anything except heavy use on Nvidia GPUs).
I agree that on average the Linux user has more technical expertise than the average windows user, but that’s mainly because the average user doesn’t choose their OS. If you take into consideration only people who actually chose their OS, I think it’s very similar.
And OP talked about his experience doing that, the default windows driver gave him a crappy resolution, and he had lots of issues getting the right driver and making it work. You skipped all of those issues because you knew beforehand which was the correct driver, and pre-downloaded it.
That is one of the first things I noticed when I’ve switched between ATI/AMD and Nvidia early in my Linux usage time. Now I’ve swapped between Nvidia, AMD, and Intel with problems in the past few years
For Oculus CV1, try Envision / Monado (OpenHMD) https://lvra.gitlab.io/docs/fossvr/envision/
they have a Matrix and Discord server too.
lol sure. When I installed a new GPU while using mint, it never booted again. Even years later when I assumed they would finally have support for the card, same story. Had to move to Ubuntu instead
I rolled my eyes real hard at this.
As a Linux supporter, this is absolutely not the case and it’s going to piss off every person who swaps to Linux thinking it’ll be this easy, and then when they’re hit with reality, switches back to Windows.
The problem they are talking about is specific to Linux Mint, not to Linux in general. Linux Mint is known for not working on newer hardware because of its outdated kernel. Ironically arch based distros would work well here as they always have a new kernel.
I’ve upgraded graphics cards multiple times with Windows, the hardest part was fitting my fat fingers in the case when I underestimated the size of the gtx660 for my tiny Dell case ages ago. I am looking into Linux atm though
While there is truth to that, it’s nice distro-hopping was a solution for me. Can’t really solve your windows problems that way.
When stuff goes sideways it’s annoying regardless. In Linux it feels easier to really get in deep and fix what needs fixing, but windows has its registry and you often end up using some random utilities that may or may not work correctly to get what you need installed.
I swear that some linux users are some of the most incompetent PC users around.
If this is your experience, you are seriously fucking shit up lmao
I think in either direction, people forget how much becomes intuitive about their OS, and how quickly we can fall into “Works on my machine”. I’m sure plenty of people have never had problems with their graphics drivers breaking things. But can you really say with full certainty that some random driver conflict couldn’t possibly happen? What if they are swapping from AMD to Nvidia, does your confidence remain?
Everything is easy and intuitive when you know what is expected of you, and everything goes according to plan, but good luck if something gets fucky.
Yeah that’s exactly what Windows is like. Things normally work fine but when something goes wrong it can be a real pain and often simpler just to reinstall as Windows doesn’t always give you good tools to fix it. When something goes wrong on a Linux system there is pretty much always some way of fixing it because it’s an open book with good tooling for diagnostics and repair. The problem is things tend to go wrong more often or be more clunky to use in the first instance.
Honestly, I think some of them have simply been off windows so long that they only know issues they’ve seen in the news, and not used the relatively smooth experience you get. Like, I swapped to Linux not too long ago. Windows was MOSTLY easier to use, but it was getting to invasive for my tastes.
If you find Linux easier to use day-to-day, you’re either A) much better than the average person at getting an intuition for all the options and controls B) doing something fairly uncommon where windows just falls short C) simply so used to Linux over Windows that you have a better intuition on how to handle Linux
And, like, sure there are specific tasks where one OS is just going to grant a smoother experience, but if we’re talking most general usage, Windows will be such a smooth use for the average user.
you sound like how some people claim linux users are 😄
I’ve been using windows since 3.1, and never had an issue swapping graphics cards. I agree that DDU being sometimes required is silly - vendors should be providing proper uninstallers, or at least officially sponsor/ship DDU.
This is how I am with mac os. I’m pretty knowledgeable about computers, so there are a lot of tasks I view as simple that I will attempt to do, only to have it fight me the whole way. I’m sure it’s just that I don’t know proper protocol, but it’s annoying.
Example would be I had some photos on my phone I wanted to put on my mom’s macbook. Okay, I have a cable, just plug it in. Well, it shows up but refuses to show files in usb mode. Okay, the photo editor saw the phone, but it was import all or nothing. It wouldn’t let me send just one folder. Okay… So I can’t copy/paste files from the phone, import is all or nothing. So… I ended up having to put the folder on a usb stick- but the the photo program wouldn’t recognise that as a source to import from, so I had to copy the folder to the desktop and THEN import from that. Something that should have been relatively simple turned into a whole ordeal because it was designed for one type of workflow and I didn’t know all the little tricks to get it to do what I wanted. I know that’s on me for not knowing the easy way ro do it, but when the obvious option ‘import’ doesn’t give me any real options, I have to figure it out.
The workflow it’s designed for is paying an iCloud subscription to sync the photos. When they introduced that they went out of their way to make transferring via cable a huge pain in the ass.
So, Windows is harder to use you say. And “incompetent” users should stick to Linux?
That’s a take that would have been absurd many years ago. I personally am willing to do things the hard way for some benefit, so I have a Windows PC for gaming. But all my other systems are Linux systems, laptop, workstation, or embedded. However Windiws is supposed to be the easier choice.
I’ll even grant that Windows PITA is mostly not deliberate action by Microsoft. It’s mostly letting vendors be their crappy self and messing up the experience, with a bit of windows driver model incompatibilities breaking hardware support abandoned by vendor, but kept alive Linux side.
Frankly, this is EXACTLY the problem that I had, that made me switch to linux.
I had a MSI laptop with a 3060. At first, it was wonky on Windows but overall it worked with a few workarounds. So far so good.
After some times, an update to Windows (I believe) made it that I had to run DDU to uninstall the drivers then reinstall everything. It took me more than one afternoon. Then I still had to do the workarounds.
After a while, I had to uninstall the video drivers at every boot, then reinstall a specific version of one driver, then had to run Windows Update, uncheck one specific little tickbox for the video card to function. At. Every. Boot.
And then, not even that worked.
On Nobara, I just had to install the distro and boom ! It worked out of the box. With the only downside that the HDMI was capped at 1080p 30Hz (when Windows wouldn’t even display over HDMI). I think the 30Hz part was a Wayland limitation at the time.
So no, it wasn’t because I was bad at Windows. Bloody thing just did not work and made me go full linux.
Laptops typically come with their own driver management software. Windows was probably trying its best to get something compatible installed, when your existing driver became outdated. There’s a decent chance that MSI supplies some specific driver for your laptop that Windows won’t touch or try to override through their own software.
Still, nice that Linux supplied better drivers by default!
Yes, those were never updated. This was the workaround : uninstall everything using DDU, then install the outdated drivers. That worked at first, then did not work anymore after a while.
I had the exact opposite experience on Mint when I changed from Nvidia to AMD. Switched the GPUs and only my main monitor in my multimonitor setup was outputting signal. That lead to annoying rabbit hole and I still haven’t finished after several months (suspend still doesn’t work every time)
The one time i borked the graphics wss the arch firmware thing.
1 weekend away arrived back late sunday to show my daughter her new graphics tab did an update rebooted like aclown and voilla no display.
After that i got rid of arch (endeavour) then in stalled arch (cachy) and life has been good.
Stuff can break and firmwsre changes do it beautifully.
Read the docs
I think if there was a Linux step, it would be to remove proprietary drivers if installed then enable nouveau. If there are features missing on your new card, move back to the proprietary.
For those who say “why install proprietary”, say hello to the annoying world of OpenCL.
ITT: Ubuntu (and downstream) users crying that they dont have a one click Nvidia solution like literally every other competent distro.
If you’re counting me in that, mint stopped booting when I switched from nvidia to amd
Every os has issues man. Linux just swaps some issues for others.
I’d much rather deal with Linux issues than windows, but that’s just me.
I’d much rather deal with Linux issues than windows, but that’s just me.
It’s not just you. ;)
Which I love about Lemmy. I truly am among friends.
I never had a issue on Windows with swapping a GPU since before xp.
Just installed a 4070… I did go to the website for the latest driver, but Windows supplied driver auto detected resolutions just fine. I was done in fifteen minutes including physically swapping card
I hate when people write lies like this, it makes Linux look bad.
Yep, never had a single issue swapping GPU on windows. First time on Linux, I went to the Nvidia website to download drivers. Apparently that’s the worst thing you can do (?!) and it took me hours to undo the mess.
Don’t get me wrong I still use Linux daily but there’s no need to lie. It has some sharp edges and GPU drivers is one of them.
You used Linux like Windows and got bad results, OP treated Windows like Linux and got bad results. The problem is neither OS but how familiar you are with it and their peculiarities.
That being said, GPU drivers are not a rough edge on Linux, only Nvidia drivers are. And even then it’s usually a single click/command to install the proprietary drivers if you need them, otherwise the open source ones work like a charm. This used to be more of a problem a few years back, when both manufacturers used proprietary drivers, but AMD ones are open now and therefore integrated into the mainstream kernel, so they just work.
…wait, so you ran the .exe??? confusion
I didn’t think Linux could let you do it XD
Ha maybe you could do it in wine? But no, you can get Linux drivers from the Nvidia website. They just didn’t work very well.
windows is shit because windows fundamentally doesn’t care about you. it’s a company and has the fiduciary responsibility to make as much profit as possible; your experience in all of this is completely secondary.
NVCleanstall helps with the Nvidia telemetry/useless feature bloat on Windows as well as keeping drivers up-to-date. It’s absurd that a third-party program is necessary, but it’s a useful program for anyone still dual-booting Windows.
Got the same for AMD?
Neat, going to have to give that a go.
https://www.techpowerup.com/download/techpowerup-nvcleanstall/
It‘s literally built into windows update. Installs and updates.
I am a passionate Fedora Linux user but even I have to admit that Windows does Drivers way better. Drover updates uncoupled from the kernel, sometimes possible without rebooting, proprietary drivers installed no problem.
Windows does Drivers way better.
…on Linux you very rarely need to do anything driver wise so I have to strongly disagree. I think I have installed drivers for 3 devices over the past few years. If Nvidia gave a shit about Linux, the only device that gave me issues wouldn’t have given me issues.
It‘s literally built into windows update. Installs and updates.
Not when you’re changing GPU vendors. It can install the drivers, sure, but not remedy the obnoxious conflict between Nvidia drivers and AMD drivers when installed in the same system.
There are no conflicts. I run an AMD APU and Nivida GPU. Got drivers for both, zero issues. Sometimes I really wonder what you people do with your linux installs that cause so many errors.
When changing GPU vendors on Linux, you’ll likely run into some more issues as well.
Especially if you are going AMD -> Nvidia
Sure, but the comment was claiming Windows Update handles everything automatically. It doesn’t, especially conflicts.
What conflict? I haven’t had issues like that in probably 10+ years.
Hell my one laptop has all 3 major vendors drivers installed and working simultaneously. Intel iGPU, Nvidia dGPU and AMD eGPU.
Don’t make me dig out the screenshot when I did exactly that and fucked my Linux install to the point where x11 shat the bed on boot and I had to abandon Linux until a few months ago
Main issue is the inconsistent drivers naturally included in Windows update and just how many things demand you install a weird vendor specific driver, with the steward of what should be a generic Winfows driver sometimes breaking things for other vendors, and/or neglecting the Windows update vintage of their driver.
Architecturally, the Windows driver model should be saner, but for most random devices I have better luck with Linux in how drivers are maintained and supported over time.
