• SanctimoniousApe@lemmings.world
    0·
    9 days ago

    The problem with the “freedom to do whatever you want” argument you’re making here is that one person (the moderator in question) has significant power and sway over what others trying to speak with similarly-minded people in that community are allowed to say - making for a serious imbalance of power. You need to use that community if there’s no other similar ones with an established & active user base which covers the topics that community is centered around.

    As such, it should be incumbent upon the moderators to strive to be as close to the ideal of “impartial” as humanly possible. It is perfectly reasonable for users to call out bad faith moderation when it happens, otherwise Lemmy will be no better than a more disjointed Reddit.

    • Libb@jlai.luEnglish
      0·
      9 days ago

      The problem with the “freedom to do whatever you want” argument you’re making here is that one person (the moderator in question) has significant power and sway over what others trying to speak with similarly-minded people in that community are allowed to say. You need to use that community if there’s no other similar ones with an established & active user base which covers the topics that community is centered around.

      Like i said, anyone is allowed to create a new community, that’s the whole idea. But one needs to be willing to do it ;)

      Edit: that existing community one is looking to replace with a new one did not magically appear with all its members already subscribed. The mod had to make it so people were willing to participate and subscribe. So, should the creator of the new community. Like I said: one needs to be willing to do it… and put the extra work.

      As such, it should be incumbent upon the moderators to strive to be as close to the ideal of “impartial” as humanly possible

      That’s personal values. Values I may myself relate too but personal values nonetheless. And certainly not some indisputable truth that should be imposed upon everybody. At least, not in my mind.

      It is perfectly reasonable for users to call out bad faith moderation when it happens

      Indeed, exactly like I wrote earlier: if someone was ‘abusing’ their moderating power in some community I was part of I see only two reasonable options, both starting by raising the issue within the community, discussing it with other members

      Then, actions can be taken. I just see no valid reason to appeal to some extra (new layer of) authority when all the power is already in the hands of the users.

      Pilling up on authorities will never compensate for the lack of personal investment.

        • Libb@jlai.luEnglish
          0·
          8 days ago

          How do you raise your voice in a community if you get silenced there?

          You don’t raise your voice (making more noise rarely helps, imho). You raise everyone else awareness that something odd could be happening in regard to some people/you being silenced?

          I have never considered the question (I try not to participate in communities where people abuse their power, or to discuss with people that consider a personal aggression any disagreement or diverging opinion) but the first things that come to my mind is that if you get silenced (that can’t be know for sure before trying to publicly post your question in the community), you can still post in other communities that you know members of the first community do read (or in communities created to raise awareness on power abuse, and ask for suggestions). And you can message other users directly to ask them to raise the question publicly for you since you’ve been silenced. And then you can create your own community and start posting: the public timeline is, well, public, anyone will have a chance to read your post. But, really, those are just the first few ideas I would consider if my choice would not be to avoid being in a situation like that to begin with.

      • fine_sandy_bottom@discuss.tchncs.de
        0·
        8 days ago

        all the power is already in the hands of the users.

        but the users are being manipulated. The vast majority will never look at the mod log and never realise that the comments they’re seeing have been editorialised.

        • Libb@jlai.luEnglish
          0·
          8 days ago

          but the users are being manipulated. The vast majority will never look at the mod log and never realise that the comments they’re seeing have been editorialised.

          Hence, what I mentioned two times: the need to inform them by opening the discussion first.
          Users don’t need to be gifted/attributed a new leader/mod. They need to decide by themselves if they need a new one, or not.

          Also, if there is no clue that a comment has been removed/censored (isn’t there some default text displayed?), then that should be something to discuss with Lemmy’s devs as I don’t think deleting comments should be invisible.

        • imaqtpie@sh.itjust.works
          0·
          8 days ago

          Any user can easily see that comments have been removed, it says removed by mod, and you can also see that they weren’t downvoted heavily before removal. There’s no shadowbanning or anything like that on Lemmy, it’s right there for everyone to see.