The kid’s grandparents got him an Amazon Fire tablet and I loathe the thing. It teaches literally nothing about computing and the games they have for kids are barely even games, and are more focusing on advertising various IPs.
I’d like to get the kid started, as he learns to read, on something that will be more useful than detrimental, let that soft little brain soak up some actual computer science, literacy. I teach him about basic electrical circuits and how that translates to computing, if, and, or, xor, nor, etc. He’s got some familiar with hex (colors) and the concept of binary (on/off).
But what to get for a first computer? I almost want to get him something Linux based and turn him loose. Is there anything like that, that would require him to learn some command prompt and basic computing skills?
Every time and try and Google it, I get a bunch of crap suggestions and ads.
Linux from scratch
Scratch might be interesting to look at. As for a computer you can’t get wrong with an old ThinkPad with Debian
Scratch Jr. is designed for kids, and is available on the Kindle devices. My kid loved making the cat character move around with it :)
A Raspberry Pi. Literally designed for this sort of thing.
I almost want to get him something Linux based and turn him loose.
I don’t have a five-year-old, but if I did, I would. Worse he can do is wipe what’s on it. Can just reinstall the OS.
Maybe also hand them a simple programming environment. When I was a kid, starting kids out with Logo was a pretty easy way to go. Pretty sure that current Linux distros have some Logo variant, lets you make pretty pictures. Dunno if that’s still considered an effective route to get kids interested today.
kagis
It looks like, in Debian trixie, there’s kturtle and ucblogo; the latter was written for university students, though.
For a five-year-old, if it’s a laptop, I’d probably get something relatively-inexpensive (unless you don’t care about the financial aspect). If you can install a Linux distro on it, can probably use any old secondhand laptop, even. Don’t think that the brand matters that much, as long as one can get it up and running.
A point someone made before, though, on a Reddit discussion I was reading talking about how “kids these days can’t use computers any more, just mobile OSes” – kids used to need to learn to use a computer if they wanted to play video games, so they had a major incentive. A lot of games are accessible via mobile OSes today, so that may degrade the appeal. YouTube/TikTok are accessible on both.
I teach him about basic electrical circuits and how that translates to computing, if, and, or, xor, nor, etc. He’s got some familiar with hex (colors) and the concept of binary (on/off).
There’s a genre of programming video games. Steam doesn’t list suggested age ranges, though, so shrugs.
https://store.steampowered.com/search/?sort_by=Reviews_DESC&tags=5432&supportedlang=english&ndl=1
I haven’t played much by way of programming games myself – I mean, I’ve got enough real-world programming stuff that I’d do – so I can’t recommend much personally. Played some Mac-specific Corewars knockoff years back. When I got into programming, it was because personal computers shipped with an actual – if simple – programming environment built into it.
Problem is, what you’re talking about is really a child-rearing problem, not a technical problem. I don’t know how one makes engineeringy-stuff appealing relative to non-engineeringy stuff. I didn’t have a smartphone with YouTube and TikTok and a huge library of video games as a kid.
I did Logo back in the 80s on Apple ][s and I still remember it. Definitely recommended and I’m surprised that schools don’t try to incorporate things like this more.
Minecraft has a ton of potential. So many ways to develop creativity, problem solving, redstone, and using commands.
Then there’s modding. navigating the web to find safe ones, navigate the file explorer to put them in the right spot. Troubleshoot mods that don’t work together. (I remember having to manually change hundreds of Item IDs before they changed the system).
5 is probably too young to start with mods, but texture packs would probably go well, open up paint and start scribbling on blocks. Eventually give them paint.net (or anything more complex than Win Paint) and start messing with layers and saving things to the right file type.
Does the kindle fire let you do USB transfer for music and books? Transfer stuff manually. (Amazon taking the download feature away from the store, so books will need to be got elsewhere) I’m a big fan of Standardebooks.org, all free and public domain, not a lot of children’s books, but should be good by the time they’re 10. Although the LCD screen probably isn’t the best for reading, I’d get them an eink for reading time. Also easier to separate reading time from game time. Also if you can go to the public library for physical books. The simple responsibility of borrowing a books, taking care of it and having to return it on time is good. (I’m rambling off topic…)
Install a bunch of easy puzzle games. I’ve always like Flow, there’s also simple math ones, sudoku, jigsaws, word searches, find the object, there’s probably a hundred others.
The tablet is only as detrimental as you make it. Find games with an actual story that the kid has to read. 5 might be a bit young for RTS games, but those will definitely make him read and think. When they get stuck, show them how to find the guide online and read just enough while avoiding story spoilers.
Code combat. It’s a video game they have to program. It starts at a no code level where you build simple movement and progresses from there. It’s a great start for a kid who’s 5 or 6
Perhaps a Raspberry Pi 500 (or the older Raspberry Pi 400), can do all the things an ordinary Raspberry Pi can, but comes as a complete device with built-in keyboard. Runs Linux and is rather easy to use.
You might try something from the lego mindstorms series, tho it might be to early for the child. It allows you to program your creation from both the device itself, as well as from a pc or tablet.
Scratch is the standard response for this stuff.
I tried to get my kids interested in programming around that age. One of them showed an interest, but bounced off it. I think it’s primarily a domain problem: kids rarely want to compute. Some are interested in games, but the theory of how to create a fun game is pretty tough, so they get discouraged and lose interest.
Can the kid ride a bike yet? Kick a football? Swim?
I love reading now, but when I was 5 I only wanted to look at the pictures in books, not the words.
My friend hates to fishing, because he dad tried to force it on him before he was ready.
And if he is interested, it’s probably better you build one together than buy one.
imho.
Can the kid ride a bike yet? Kick a football? Swim?
I love reading now, but when I was 5 I only wanted to look at the pictures in books, not the words.
I was writing code in first grade, which I guess would be 6 or so. And I didn’t have a home computer back then, had to do so on what time I could scrounge up in my limited windows of time of access to other people’s computers or computers at institutions, which raised the bar. Today, computers are cheap and plentiful enough that it’s pretty easy to get ahold of one.
I could definitely write software before I could ride a bicycle. I still don’t know how to kick a football.
It’s definitely doable.
I think that a lot of what we set our expectations around is around when schools choose to teach things. Like, I remember — as an American — being shocked when I discovered how young people in the UK and some other countries started being taught foreign language. In the US, our school system doesn’t really do much by way of foreign language education until…I guess high school? 9th-12th grades, so maybe around 14-17 years old. But in the UK, you can (or used to, dunno if things have changed) take Latin in primary school.
kagis
Yeah, sounds like they made it mandatory recently:
https://www.oxfordowl.co.uk/for-home/school-year/subject-guides/languages-at-primary-school/
The 2014 Primary National Curriculum once again made learning a foreign language compulsory at Key Stage 2 (Years 3 to 6). Schools are free to choose whether to teach an ancient or a modern language; it is much more about language learning skills than the particular language on offer. Your child could therefore learn French, Spanish, Mandarin, German, Arabic or even Latin — the choices are endless! However, once your child begins secondary school the teaching of a modern foreign language is compulsory.
I thought “that seems like an incredibly-advanced topic for a young age”. But…really, that’s just my expectations set by convention here in the US, not that there’s an inability to learn language at a young age (and in fact, there are some strong arguments that learning language is easier the younger you do it).
I think that it’s possible to start learning just about anything at an early age if the child wants it.
Yes, yes, yes. That fishing advice hits close. I think him seeing me go fishing and seeing all my hesr and stuff has given him a real interest in it. I take him with me often and we make a trip of it, I do most of the fishing and we walk the river. I take a few casts, then he gets to throw rocks. We also spend time finding cool rocks and learning about whatever cool plants and bugs we find.
I like the idea of building one together.
Enjoy.
I agree with the idea of trying lots of different things, especially physical activities. If you’re kid falls in love with computers early that’s awesome but it can also lead them down a road of bad health habits.
If he has support, he’ll be fine. My issues learning stuff growing up was no one in my family to teach me anything, so frustration and giving up was common. Imo fishings just boring af most ppl would hate it, especially if you don’t like nature. Learning code is way easier younger, your brain just makes associations related to language easier. Coding itself isn’t particularlly hard, easier the younger you learn.
There are coding related games on iphone like human resource factory that might help.Id introduce them to scratch on the tablet and see if they like that.
I agree most people hate fishing and find it boring. I am a diehard fly fisherman and fancy myself as an angler; I’m not fishing, hoping I might get lucky and catch something. I’m working an angle, trying to fool a fish. And given our relative brain size, if I can’t fool a fish, I have bigger problems. There’s no luck about it.
Just make sure he has a computer and he’ll learn
I’ve recently introduced my 5 year old to Luanti (open source Minecraft clone). He loves it, sees me open terminals (Linux only house), use the in-game terminal which I’m teaching him to use, learns what keys are where etc. and personally I’m OK with that for now. Baby steps.
My own computer route was to play games initially (load “”) then move on to coding later. It is much easier to learn coding now than it was then but just moving him off the tablet will already be a huge win. If he shows an aptitude or interest in it, coderdojo or similar will be waiting.
Oh! If you do decide to do something similar, I hooked the laptop up to the TV with keyboard and mouse and it was a huge win both in fine motor control and fun!
Good luck!
It’s great that you want to support your kid and hopefully get them away from the focus-destroying dopamine traps that are many „kid friendly“ apps. But please ask yourself what your kid likes first, not what you want them to be interested in. It’s perfectly fine to restrict tablet time and let him focus on what he likes, be it computer stuff or football or cycling or reading or painting or whatever. If he really interested in Linux and nor, xor etc that’s great, but don’t force it on him.
And that is coming from someone who bought and built his first own computer around that age and wrote his first few lines of very basic basic code not long after. Not because it was expected of me, but because I was interested and given the opportunity to follow those interests.
So, if that kid is interested in computers, Minecraft is a great game for kids. It encourages creativity, problem solving, perseverance and, maybe later, collaboration. It’s also possible to play together and scale their experience to their age: get started in creative or peaceful, then let them discover mobs and mods when they are a bit older, then let them play with friends.
If the kid likes building and Legos, you might want to look into Lego Boost and Spike, although they are rather expensive.
Oh, and paint. Kids love paint, be it MS paint, Paint.net or any other open source alternative. Show them that with a computer they can create, not just consume.
Shit, Minecraft is a great game for adults. I will follow up on some of these suggestions for sure.
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Buy an used PC/laptop (Optiplex can do)
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Buy a SATA SSD if the PC comes with a HDD, and swap it
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If the PC comes with 4 GB of RAM, try to expand it to 8 GB
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Install Linux on it
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Done
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I agree with sibling comments about not forcing anything on kids. I hate sports because I was made to play seasonal sports (tee ball, basketball, soccer) in elementary school and middle school. The only sport I’ll play is freestyle frisbee in a field.
Just have a computer available. Agree with the idea of showing how to create drawings and such. Then go full hands off. If it happens, it happens.
I say this as a computer person working in tech.
