I realize this is probably a silly question, but can he even do that? The power of pardon only extends to federal crimes. The state of Michigan could still press charges and there is fuck all Dumb Dumb can do about it. Unless I miss something here.
(This is ignoring whatever his cronies at state level can do to obfuscate the situation of course)
I’m not sure if you’ve been paying attention, but federal courts have been stopping him left and right. The most common situation has been Trump signs an EO or takes other action, federal court blocks said action, administration whines and moans but is forced to go along with the ruling.
You can count on one hand the times this administration has successfully ignored a court order.
They’ve also been ignoring those judges. I 100% believe, especially with the immigration stuff, that he’s still carrying on what they ordered the administration not to do, only quieter.
The most high-profile case of ignoring the judges has been the Kilmar Abrego Garcia case, where the ruling came when he was already en route. The courts have also said the administration had to take all reasonable actions to facilitate his return, or words to that effect, which they’ve surely not done.
Aside from that, in what other instances have they successfully ignored court rulings? I’m sure there have been a few, but not many.
In regards to this particular thread, a pardon of state crimes doesn’t mean anything because no one would listen to it. States run themselves when it comes to criminal justice. Short of marching the military in and causing an actual civil war, there’s no method for enforcing that.
It’s important not to doom. Despair is the enemy. Stay positive but stay vigilant.
It’s important not to doom. Despair is the enemy. Stay positive but stay vigilant.
It’s not “doom” it’s being honest and real about our current situation.
People need to realize what is happening to their country, and as of right now, my experience in the real world has been that most people have no fucking clue. Like, to a startling degree.
Pretending everything is ok just keeps them out of the loop longer while these people literally destroy our country from the inside.
Maybe if people/the media were reacting appropriately to what has been happening, people would actually be aware. And “staying positive!” is not an appropriate reaction to what is happening.
You can count on one hand the times this administration has successfully ignored a court order.
Oh well in that case, there’s nothing to worry about!
It’s amazing how successful he’s been at lowering the expectations for the office. For a Republican, at least. I’m certain, if a Democrat is able to become president again, that bar will suddenly rise back up.
If he doesn’t have the legal powers to do this, he’ll pressure the people who do.
If they’re charged at the state level the “people who do” is Democratic governor Gretchen Whitmer. You may recognize the name as the person they plotted to kidnap.
It depends on how the state charges against them were dropped. Basically, the state can say why they’re dropping charges. In many cases, the state won’t bother charging them if the feds have a good case. In these cases, they often drop the charges without prejudice, which is basically the state going “we’re dropping these charges because the higher courts have you, but we can open the case again if the feds bungle it.”
In contrast, they can also choose to drop the charges with prejudice. This is usually what happens when the state doesn’t believe they have enough evidence to bring to trial. Basically, it’s the state going “eh, we won’t bother with this again in the future.” So if the charges were dropped without prejudice, then they could potentially be opened again.
I’d actually be curious to see if the pardon can be used against them, because US v. Burdick ruled that accepting the pardon also requires admitting that you are guilty of the crime you’re being pardoned for. The dude wanted to selectively refuse the first “I admit I’m guilty of this crime” part of the pardon, but accept the second “and accept the presidential pardon” part. The court ruled that the person being pardoned can’t accept the pardon without also admitting guilt. Lorrance v. Commandant USDB ruled that a presidential pardon doesn’t override habeas corpus, meaning the people would still have a right to a trial… Basically, the government wanted to take a dude’s presidential pardon, and use it to say “well he already admitted guilt, so we can just jump straight to sentencing. No need for a trial.” That got shot down. But it’s unclear whether or not that admission of guilt can be used against them during said trial.
I realize this is probably a silly question, but can he even do that? The power of pardon only extends to federal crimes. The state of Michigan could still press charges and there is fuck all Dumb Dumb can do about it. Unless I miss something here.
(This is ignoring whatever his cronies at state level can do to obfuscate the situation of course)
You are correct. Typically you don’t see crimes charged at both the state and federal level, but they’re not exclusive.
deleted by creator
I’m not sure if you’ve been paying attention, but federal courts have been stopping him left and right. The most common situation has been Trump signs an EO or takes other action, federal court blocks said action, administration whines and moans but is forced to go along with the ruling.
You can count on one hand the times this administration has successfully ignored a court order.
That’s still one hand too many.
Good thing the funding bill removes all funding to enforce injunctions…
They’ve also been ignoring those judges. I 100% believe, especially with the immigration stuff, that he’s still carrying on what they ordered the administration not to do, only quieter.
The most high-profile case of ignoring the judges has been the Kilmar Abrego Garcia case, where the ruling came when he was already en route. The courts have also said the administration had to take all reasonable actions to facilitate his return, or words to that effect, which they’ve surely not done.
Aside from that, in what other instances have they successfully ignored court rulings? I’m sure there have been a few, but not many.
In regards to this particular thread, a pardon of state crimes doesn’t mean anything because no one would listen to it. States run themselves when it comes to criminal justice. Short of marching the military in and causing an actual civil war, there’s no method for enforcing that.
It’s important not to doom. Despair is the enemy. Stay positive but stay vigilant.
It’s not “doom” it’s being honest and real about our current situation.
People need to realize what is happening to their country, and as of right now, my experience in the real world has been that most people have no fucking clue. Like, to a startling degree.
Pretending everything is ok just keeps them out of the loop longer while these people literally destroy our country from the inside.
Maybe if people/the media were reacting appropriately to what has been happening, people would actually be aware. And “staying positive!” is not an appropriate reaction to what is happening.
deleted by creator
Oh well in that case, there’s nothing to worry about!
It’s amazing how successful he’s been at lowering the expectations for the office. For a Republican, at least. I’m certain, if a Democrat is able to become president again, that bar will suddenly rise back up.
If they’re charged at the state level the “people who do” is Democratic governor Gretchen Whitmer. You may recognize the name as the person they plotted to kidnap.
I don’t see anyone with the guts to stop him.
It depends on how the state charges against them were dropped. Basically, the state can say why they’re dropping charges. In many cases, the state won’t bother charging them if the feds have a good case. In these cases, they often drop the charges without prejudice, which is basically the state going “we’re dropping these charges because the higher courts have you, but we can open the case again if the feds bungle it.”
In contrast, they can also choose to drop the charges with prejudice. This is usually what happens when the state doesn’t believe they have enough evidence to bring to trial. Basically, it’s the state going “eh, we won’t bother with this again in the future.” So if the charges were dropped without prejudice, then they could potentially be opened again.
I’d actually be curious to see if the pardon can be used against them, because US v. Burdick ruled that accepting the pardon also requires admitting that you are guilty of the crime you’re being pardoned for. The dude wanted to selectively refuse the first “I admit I’m guilty of this crime” part of the pardon, but accept the second “and accept the presidential pardon” part. The court ruled that the person being pardoned can’t accept the pardon without also admitting guilt. Lorrance v. Commandant USDB ruled that a presidential pardon doesn’t override habeas corpus, meaning the people would still have a right to a trial… Basically, the government wanted to take a dude’s presidential pardon, and use it to say “well he already admitted guilt, so we can just jump straight to sentencing. No need for a trial.” That got shot down. But it’s unclear whether or not that admission of guilt can be used against them during said trial.