A lot of the things we do on a daily or weekly basis have ways of doing them that can either be private or communal, some of these which we do not think to consider as having that characteristic.
For example, bathing in the Roman Empire used to be communal, but then Rome fell and citizens in the splinter countries began taking baths privately.
Receiving mail is another example. There are countries which don’t have mailboxes and everyone gets their mail at the post office in the PO boxes. It was the United States which pioneered the idea of the modern mail system, which is why we associate it as a private act.
There are activities as well which don’t have any history as jumping between one or the other that might benefit from it, for example I think towns might benefit if internet was free and freely accessible but only at the local library.
What’s a non-communal aspect of life you think should be communal?
Your mom. Where you going hear me out.
Grocery stores
They shouldn’t be stores at all since that’s putting prices on necessary food for living.
I work at one and am constantly appalled at the prices for basic food items like canned tuna or pasta (not even the “good” stuff, just the run of the mill “well, it’s ____”)
Funny mentioning the mail thing in the US… I’ve never had a singular mailbox and I’ve lived in California my whole life. Always had a communal mailbox somewhere in the neighborhood (or my apartment now) where everyone’s mailbox is in like a big bank of boxes.
I kinda hate it. Mostly because the neighborhood Karen would always be at the thing and always had some shit to say to me, even when I was a little-ass kid.
I always wished we had community baths though. Seems like everywhere else in the world does that except us. Definitely would be cooler to normalize being naked around strangers.
… Why should private internet be banned or discouraged? What benefits would that being?
It’s a bit of a cop out, but maybe talking about and dealing with feelings. At best people usually only talk privately with a professional for money. Normalise just having regular group therapy for everyone that they can just drop in and out of.
Or if we want to really push boundaries: Orgies and kink parties. Sex is a natural part of life, no need to keep it secret.
I’m not sure that something like a public orgy would be a good idea, not because of “morals” (I tend to think modern society is far too repressed about sexual stuff), but because of the health implications that would come of encouraging sexual contact between large groups of strangers. That sounds like a recipe for STI spread unless you were very strict and thorough with testing, vetting participants, and enforcing protective measures, which inevitably not every instance would be.
However, if talking and partaking in sexual acts is less stigmatised, people will hopefully feel a lot more comfortable about getting tested and talking about it.
And honestly, if it does turn out to be that big a problem, vetting and requiring regular testing seems a reasonable thing to require before people are allowed in.
We should be using neighbourhood food co-ops to purchase and distribute food from farmers and wholesalers rather than from retailers.
A co-op has been in the works in my town for the last few years and it’s finally about to open. I can’t wait
What town is that?
Lombard, Illinois.
Cooking. 5 people working together can cook for 100 people easier, cheaper, and less wastefully than 100 people can cook for themselves/their families.
Unfortunately the current restaurant system in the US is incredibly wasteful, expensive, and pays fuckall.
Taste differences make cooking specially messy to communalise. Not impossible though.
Verified: group cooking is the way.
I have friends and family who live in a cohousing building. About 50 people in 30 units. Each apartment is complete but the kitchens are slightly smaller than typical.
Cohousing is mutual ownership of the building. About 20% of the building is common areas, like widened hallways with couches and bookshelves, or a games nook, music room, workshop, laundry, etc. It’s basically a tall village, and they are like roommates with privacy.
The giant kitchen and dining room is used six nights a week. One person is chef with a small crew, and dinner is for around 30 people. It costs $5 CDN per meal, though if you raid the leftovers later it’s pay what you want, usually $2. The cooking volunteer roster is optional and organized by a Slack channel. Food is usually awesome and everyone wins.
If you want you hardly ever have to cook dinner for yourself.
Amazing. May I ask what region of the world you’re describing?
I sometimes think about automats, and what a modernized version, designed to both be healthy enough to eat as one’s primary meal source without ill effect and efficient enough to compete in price with home cooking, might be like. I suspect it would probably involve a lot of soup and chili and the like, just because that stuff is relatively simple to produce in large quantities, and uses cheap yet generally healthy ingredients
This makes me think of the Sikh community’s charity/giving (can’t remember the term) food giving that happens in most towns globally where there a Gurdwara.
There has to be a better way than waves hands everything, really.
Generally think private homes are a giant waste, both in terms of wasted physical space and energy lost due to poor insulation.
Living should be communal. No residential construction should hold less than eight housing units.
After you do this, you can consolidate a bunch of an amenities - washing machines, parking, central heating/AC, pools, gardens, outdoor grills, wet and dry bars, basements, rumpace rooms, home theaters.
It all gets so much nicer when it’s a communal living space.
Yeah, no. Apartment living sucks ass. I’d rather live in the suburbs. My neighbors are close but far. We can’t hear each other normally. It’s great.
Apartment living sucks ass. I’d rather live in the suburbs.
Live in a nice apartment. Makes all the difference.
The suburbs are horrendous. Everything is five miles away, you’re in gridlock when school starts or lets out, and the only social activities are pay-to-play. Spent my childhood in the suburbs and it was miserable.
We can’t hear each other normally.
Lived in an apartment for ten years and I couldn’t hear a peak from my neighbors, because the walls were wide and padded. Moved into a townhouse with single-pane glass windows. Neighbor’s kids were practically in my living room until I upgraded to double-pane a few years later. Insulation is a total game changer.
Past that, anyone who lives in a neighborhood with teenagers will hear those teenagers. As soon as someone gets a motorbike with a cut-out muffler, everyone on the block knows what time they get home.
Where I live apartments are places that people try to leave. People who live in apartments are generally less well off and have problems with crime and anti-social behavior. There were 2 murders in 3 years where I lived. Moved back to my parent’s house and then was lucky enough to be able to buy a house.
It’s just not something that I would want to do again unless I was forced to.
People who live in apartments are generally less well off and have problems with crime and anti-social behavior.
There are apartment buildings in my city of Houston where the base units rent for north of $10k/mo. Housing is cheaper (relatively speaking) but you don’t get the kind of access or amenities that these spaces provide. If there are criminals in these units, its all white collar crime. Nobody is stealing catalytic converters to pay rent at the Riverway Plaza.
Live in a nice upscale spot and you’ll enjoy the apartment lifestyle. Live in a falling over money pit and you’ll hate home ownership.
Moved back to my parent’s house and then was lucky enough to be able to buy a house.
The great thing about parents is that they’ve already paid off their mortgage (or near enough) that they financed on a property purchased decades beforehand. But the down payment on a house costs more (even in PPP adjusted dollars) than the whole unit would thirty years ago.
That’s not a rich-guy / poor-guy problem, its an old-guy / young-guy problem.
Most cities in the South stink. Our suburban school district is the best in the state. Very little crime. My house is the correct size thankfully. I can afford it.
10k/month for an apartment. Lol. That is a rich guy thing. My mortgage is $750/month.
I don’t like all the people everywhere anyway. Whatever floats your boat.
Amazingly my parents house and my house cost the same at purchase. $130kish. A lot of things fell into place for us to be able to buy a house. I did get lucky.
I’ve lived in shared housing. Never again. I’m way too introverted and can’t stand how poorly some people clean nor how badly the behave to others (loudness, using resources inconsiderately, etc.)
I’ll be social when I have the energy. I help out my neighbors when they need it. We do have community events about monthly where we cut grass, clean up, etc.
This is a wild take. There is value in privacy. There is value in quiet! There is value in space. Electricity efficiency isn’t the only important thing!
washing machines, parking, central heating/AC, pools, gardens, outdoor grills, wet and dry bars, basements, rumpace rooms, home theaters.
Aw hell naw. Tell me you’ve never been poor enough to have to use a shared washing machine or even a laundromat without telling me you never had to. Those things are absolutely disgusting.
I used to believe in dense housing in cities until I had two sets of psycho upstairs neighbours and no thanks, I want to be as far away from another human being as reasonably feasible at all times, nevermind not share a fucking pool with one.
Tell me you’ve never been poor enough to have to use a shared washing machine
Literally every college kid ever. Lots of apartments and dorms have laundramats. They save space within the units, you can do two or three loads at once, and when you’ve got one per floor its never really a problem except on the day after exams when everyone is cleaning up and shipping out at once.
I used to believe in dense housing in cities until I had two sets of psycho upstairs neighbours and no thanks
In my experience, a little insulation goes a long way. A couple of extra inches of wall thickness transform shouting/cheering/screaming kids into faint muffles. Meanwhile, anyone that’s had to live in an HOA community knows the annoyance of getting a nasty-gram from a neighbor down the street who might as well have had her ears shoved up against your window in order to complain that you had a party.
Folks in the suburbs somehow manage to develop Superman hearing and still complain about everything. Folks in midtown townhomes experience night-and-day differences when they get double-panned glass. Nice apartments have thick walls (good for heating/cooling as well as sound-proofing) and let you enjoy your privacy as soon as you shut the door.
Greetings from Sweden, here shared washing machines are really common and generally not disguisting at all.
There are also solutions to people behaving badly in apartment buildings. Unfortunate if nothing was done at yours, but it’s definitely not an impossible problem to solve.
Poor introverts in this scenario.
Some people like living in communal spaces and some, like me, loathe it. Seriously, fuck that. Maybe more and affordable complexes do need to be built, but it should never be the only option.
I’d rather put a bullet through my brain pan
That’s a nice idea, but how do we decide on who gets to live in the communal space?
Production
REproduction
Once upon a time, I took a Communist Manifesto out of my local library, which I later discovered was a fake, and one of the tenets called for communal hooking-up.
I’m with it
Management and operations of any apartment buildings.
Make em all co ops.
are there actually places where the public library doesn’t already offer free internet access?
This is very close to your mail example but can we please move on from delivering items directly to houses? Just give me a destribution center or box at a 10-15 min walking distance and I’ll gladly pick up everything from there when it’s actually convenient. We can still keep the other model for special cases.
What if we work backwards on this?
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Introduce community boxes at junction points where USPS already delivers, and/or next to a parks so you can say hi to your neighbors and stuff. Ensure any box is within a tolerable walking distance for the average community member served. (Best figure five minutes here folks.)
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Allow residents with mail being delivered to their physical addresses to opt in to delivery at their associated neighborhood box.
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Market the boxes as happy medium between visiting a staffed post office at the center of a city and risky doorstep delivery. Locked boxes large enough to accommodate everyday parcels basically nix those pesky pilfering porch pirates.
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Continue regularly scheduled deliveries to individual addresses because the route will continue to exist at some level of specificity anyway no matter how many or how few community boxes materialize. Carriers essentially keep the same routes but get to drop mad loads of
malemail in one or multiple convenient spots, driving efficiency up and logistics strategists wild. -
Promoting additional box patronage by offering a slight discount whenever postage/shipping is purchased for a specific physical address utilizing delivery to a community box. Immediate and total coverage of community boxes across America is neither expected nor necessary, but hell, reward those who lighten the load for others.
.
Please… call me Louisa REjoy
But doesn’t this already exist? For most packages I get, I can choose to either have them delivered to my door or to a package station, where I put my delivery number in and it unlocks the compartment my package is in. Same for sending packages.
Here’s an example:
.I’m in Europe though, not sure if it’s a thing in the US.
That’s pretty much the idea, you put it in much better words than me. Let’s make community boxes the default and if you want home delivery you can have that.
Side comment, I don’t get how the US deals with porch pirates. Here someone needs to be at home and sign to receive the delivery because literally leave a brick outside and it will have been picked up by someone within the next couple of hours.
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“special cases” being everyone who doesn’t live in a town? I’m lucky in that my village post office hasn’t been shut down, but I’d still have to drive to collect my post every day. It’s much more efficient that a single vehicle delivers post to hundreds of houses.
Maybe it makes sense in urban areas for able-bodied people. Still a drag to have to walk there every day when you don’t even know if you’ve got post because something important might have arrived.
Sorry, I didn’t mean to poop on your idea so much, it is a genuinely interesting idea, I just don’t think it works with the way society is currently set up in my country
Or disabled.
Sorry yes this assumes you live in a place where you can walk to something like a post office or a supermarket. Rural US may not have this but that’s already kind of a problem. You don’t have to go every day though. You can just get a notification when your delivery is actually there. This is already done in some places by companies but in a smaller scale where the available boxes are very limited and only for smaller items. With special cases I meant people who have trouble leaving the house for whatever reason.
Rural Japan here. It would take me more than an hour each way to get to the post office (75-80mins). Ain’t no way when I generally get time-sensitive documents at least a few weeks each year. Also, especially rural but even suburban and urban Japan is generally elderly and has less mobility.
We do have to go to a post box to drop our outgoing mail, though, and I think that’s much easier (that’s a 10-15 minute walk) especially since that’s generally a rarer action.
Honestly If I could just get the part when they notify me when there’s something to pick up and make junk mail illegal that would be great. As it is I hate checking my mail box every day just to dump literally all of it directly into the trash. I would love to just be notified when there is actually something I need to pay attention to.
I could see delivery drivers really appreciating this. They deserve a break.
Re: internet only available at the public library.
Hell no. That would really fuck over disabled people.
Plus, nobody needs to see the porn I watch.
I mean, we could make that a communal activity too…
Yes, but some of us do, so give us the goods already
That would mainly be because they can’t easily get to the library, probably because your city is too low-density and car-dependant.
Once again, all problems are zoning problems in disguise.
Wait, it would? My local library’s biggest demographic is disabled people.
I think they assume you want to make the internet only accessible at the library, instead of making it free at the library while still available elsewhere
BTW in Germany there is free internet in public buildings and transport
It would fuck me over.
transportation, natch
Clothes being optional
Im not saying we should be nude all the time. Clothes have their purpose.I think we should have the option to be nude in public, without making it sexual
Nude beaches are nice places for exactly this reason. It’s like everyone tacitly agrees not to give a shit.
You can walk past people with your balls waving in the breeze and nobody even blinks - and more importantly, someone can walk past you with their tits akimbo and you don’t even blink. It’s not sexual, it’s not even interesting, it has no significance here. It’s like seeing someone breastfeeding: yes, boobs are still great, but we’re not doing that right now.
And that’s just a really nice headspace to be in. All of the unconscious monkey-politics games just go away, you don’t have to think of people in those terms, or concern yourself with where you stand relative to them, because we’re just not doing that.
Oh no, you’ll see unattractive naked people! Yep, most of them in fact. And honestly that’s kind of awesome. 85yo woman pottering around living her best life stark naked and not giving one single shit: you go girl. Fuck yeah. You know how people say they look forward to being old enough to just not give a fuck any more? You can have that yourself right now, right here, for free.
It’s funny, walking past clothed beaches afterwards, you realise just how sexualised many swimsuits really are. A bunch of naked people are honestly about as glamorous and exciting as a pile of dead sheep; fashion designers do one hell of a job creating drama and hype around it all.
I never feel inconvenienced by having to wear clothing. I suppose part of that is because as a man, I can go shirtless without getting stares and I wouldn’t want to be without underwear (for support) even if I were on a deserted island. I wonder what the circumstances you have in mind are in which you would like to have the option of being nude in public.
Edit: Now that I think about it, there have been a few times when I wanted to go swimming and just swimming in my underwear wasn’t an option because I would have to walk while wearing it later and that would be uncomfortable.
In addition to your example, I’ll think of a few of my own:
- Washing your car (wash yourself while you’re at it)
- The weather is comfortable enough to not wear clothes (instead of having 1 layer, go down to 0)
- Don’t want to do laundry (in fact, you save money by not dirtying up clothes as often)
- You do not have to change outfits (swimming to exercise to sleep, etc.)
- You get more vitamin D
- No tan lines
- Allows your skin to breathe and take in the weather: rain, sun, wind
Most places in the US legally allow nudity, with the main barrier being people calling the police and making a big deal out of doing something legal.
What? I don’t think this is true.
Many places allow toplessness but very few allow full nudity.
It isn’t about allowing. It is about not prohibiting.
Most places haven’t prohibited nudity because most people don’t choose to be nude.
It’s often covered under obscenity and sex offender laws, though.
In my area, you can be nude on private property as long as a neighbor has to make an effort to see you. My back yard allows it.
I think towns might benefit if internet was free and freely accessible but only at the local library.
Are you saying that private access to internet should be illegal?
Or that your libraries don’t offer internet access to its patrons?
The first one. Or perhaps it shouldn’t be illegal but rather discouraged in some way.
Isn’t that already true? Internet is available for free at the library. The discouragement part is that you have to pay for it at home or on your phone
I wish it was illegal but only for you so I don’t have to read nonsense like this again.
You do realize a significant portion of the internet is porn, right? There is no world in which everyone has to go to a communal public building for their pornography consumption that I’d be happy with.
Gonna be honest there are few things I would like less than the criminalizing of my main way of keeping in contact with people. I genuinely think doing that would cause a spike in suicide rates because there are so many people who would just suddenly be completely isolated from having any community
What possible argument could you have for that? That’s just absolutely ridiculous.
I’m also curious as to why! (And I didn’t downvote you)
Please let me know if you share in another comment!
Out of curiosity, why?
If it’s only available at one place, it’s not freely accessible.
Logistically, how would that work? Libraries would have to be everywhere and they’d have to be massive. The IT infrastructure to support that would be immense. How would privacy work? Where could I go to have a private telehealth appointment, for example.
Freely accessible just means anyone can get to a library, no? I’m not saying that internet should ONLY be at the library. That’s OP, lol
Libraries where I live offer internet access to any patron (who must be a resident of the city). I can comfortably walk to 3 libraries, but only 1 is within a 15-minute walk. Not everyone in my city is so fortunate, but someone with limited internet needs has many options for free here.
Oh I understood. I agree with you.
I would argue that something that was once available at home that is then restricted to a single place that must be shared with lots of people isn’t freely accessible.
My local library is within walking distance, but it’s pretty small. The Internet is free but not awesome in terms of speed.
