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Depends on how you define “Christian”. If you mean called himself Christian and recognized it as a distinct, and separate religion from Judaism, then never.
If you define it simply as “someone who believes Jesus was the Messiah and died for our sins” well then he was always Christian.
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wait. if jesus is a christian is god a jew?
Actually yes, the Old Testament is basically the Torah or “the Jew book”.
I grew up a fundamentalist Southern Baptist. In my late teens I started to question. One of the things that helped me drop Christianity was the thought process trying to answer: Who was the first Jew who died and went to hell because they didn’t accept Jesus as their saviour?
Because biblically, the Jews were the Chosen People, right? So if you were Jewish, you went to heaven. But according to Christians, you have to accept Jesus now.
So when did that happen, exactly? When was it that the last Jew died and went to heaven, and the next Jew died and went to hell?
What is crazy to me is Jews don’t “believe” in Jesus Christ. Absolutely absurd to me they just ignore him. Just more proof that they probably did crucify him 😭
For me it was hearing sermons on, and then reading for myself, the Book of Job.
Just awful shit.
I don’t know if I’m remembering this correctly. But I thought the church taught that everyone went below (don’t remember the exact name of the place) and between Jesus’s death and resurrection, he took the keys to heaven and he’ll and preached to those who were not alive to hear his message and then those who accepted him were saved.
Sort of. Before Jesus, the gates of heaven were closed for reasons. After he was crucified and paid the price for original sin he opened the gates of heaven and saved all the people in hell.
Depends on the christian branch you got taught in.
I used to be a roman catholic, They belief that with jesus’ death the primal sinn was absolved. If you accept jesus as the lord the savior son of god, you never will go to hell. Sinning puts you in purgatory, a hell-light kinda, for a duration to punish you for sinning. But after that you go to heaven regardless.
Before jesus everyone went to tell due to the first sinn commited by adam and eve. A few exceptions. Moses was promised heaven if he stayed faithful, but because of his doubt at the end, he got condemed to hell, but was allowed to see the sacret land before he died.
When he read a self help book that said you have to believe in yourself. Guess he took it too far. :)
Unless he became one long after he died, never.
Posthumously.
I never picked up on his humor in the bible.
I thought the Bible really nailed his sense of humor.
Don’t joke about that. You’ll make the Christians cross.
The bible was based off The Life of Brian though
That’s kind of like asking ‘when did Rogue become a rogue-like?’
He didn’t.
yeah, the trappings of a death cult didn’t sit well with him, plus the whole cross thing was a real turn off. Imagine if a guillotine had killed you and you come back to see a religion spring up using guillotines as their symbol
I believe the early symbol of Christianity was the Icthys, then the Chi-Rho, before European Christians settled on the Latin cross.
It less fun if you well-ackshually, but I appreciate the scholarship
Never - he was a Jewish prophet. Christianity was invented by Paulus.
Why did a jewish prophet become the spokesperson for a different religion?
He didn’t. He is still the Jewish prophet for the Jewish cult offshoot that was then a branch of Judaism and is now called Christianity. Original christians are really Jews with some extra lore on top. But people are people and people are tribal and they need someone band against together, so now we have a plethora of different abrahamic religions that are all pissy and nasty against each other.
Because his followers created the religion based off of his teachings. After he died.
He wasn’t a very good jewish prophet if his teachings made people not want to be jewish.
Arguably they didn’t. The modern trappings of Christianity were invented out of the whole cloth from Paul of Tarsus, when he had a “vision” of Jesus conveniently not seen by anyone else purportedly while he was traveling on the road to Damascus. Notably, all of this went down some decades after big J’s death.
It was Paul who discarded the bulk of the Jewish stuff, either out of desire to make it more palatable to his Roman peers or, possibly, simply because he was a raving nut. Paul was a self-described persecutor of the existing Christians, so he would have been in a pretty good position to know what their beliefs were to use as a starting point.
Paul hated christians so he invented christianity?
As he told it, Paul hated Christians and then had a vision of Jesus who told him off about it, and then he had a big change of heart and invented (modern) Christianity.
That’s wild I’m just reading the wiki link you provided.
I think you need to understand that nobody here is provoked by this and people are genuinely trying to help you understand what you are asking about. Because you come off as attempting to be an edgy troll and failing miserably.
Mohammed did the same thing. It’s how many religions branch off.
Wait could you explain that one more? I read his biography before and explicitly remember him becoming a Muslim at 40.
I’m gonna send you to Religion for Breakfast and Useful Charts on YouTube. I don’t remember this well enough offhand
Mohammad was a jew?
I don’t think so but Islam was heavily influenced by Judaism, Zoroastrianism, and Sabianism back in the day.
Sabianism is interesting, because I’ve read (don’t recall the source, sorry!) that they had a chance to convert to Islam or die, so they became “technically” Muslim, without really being Muslim. I don’t really know though, but if you can toss me any educational links about it, I’d really appreciate it.
Judaism, Christianity and Islam all are abrahemitic religions and share the same roots, so pretty much, yes
Although I’m not that versed with the story of Mohammed
Not really. He was a prince in a branch of Judaism that often lists Jesus as a prophet. Kinda. You’re gonna have to hit Wikipedia or YouTube. Religion for breakfast maybe?
It was convenient. Him being already dead, he couldn’t get in the way.
he’s not a christian yet, but i’m pretty sure i’ll be able to convince him before the end of this year
Like with all religions in general, his parents decided.
This is a semantic argument. I say that Jesus is not a Christian, because Christians are those who follow Christ.
I think that Jesus is a Jewish reformist.
Esoterica channel on YouTube has a merkavah series you may find helpful. It’s about 10 episodes so I don’t recall exactly which addresses it, though.
He never existed. He is a figment of a religious groups imagination. He is a fictitious character based on ideas of what a religion needs as a figurehead.
He did. That is a fact that this person existed. If all that really happened like writen in the bible, what he did eeh who knows. Roman scribes wrote of him for example.
It is suprising what all from the bible is actually true. Especially old testament. ( please do correct me on this im not that deep in the thora and judeism) the old testament is basicly the thora and the thora is among other things the history of the tribes of isreal.
The 10 plagues are proven, that there was a “tower of bable”, Sodom and Gomorra, the city, from what i know are also proven to have existed.
But i’d gladly would like to hear, why you think Iesus of nazared is supposed to be fiction? The apostals all existed and their letters are one prove for that. that romans persuated christians is a known fact. Plus what would’ve been the goal to make up such a figure, like jesus? To create even more unrest in the roman empire? The jews were tolerated by romans. Early christianity was not an organized centralized power structure that it grew to become with the byzantium empire and then, after the big schism, the papacy.
“The 10 plagues are proven, that there was a “tower of bable”, Sodom and Gomorra, the city, from what i know are also proven to have existed.”
None of those are proven. Egyptians kept good records and there are no records of Hebrew slaves in Egypt, and no records of the plagues or their escape. Furthermore, the Bible says the hebrews had 600,000 men in their army, which means easily 2-3 million people in all. This is roughly the same as the population of Egypt at the time.
I’ve never heard anyone claim there’s any evidence for the Tower of Babel so I can’t comment on that, but people claiming Sodom and Gammorah existed point to naturally occurring Sulfer deposits as proof.
“But i’d gladly would like to hear, why you think Iesus of nazared is supposed to be fiction?”
Mythicism, the idea that Jesus wasn’t a real person, is not new but has risen in popularity on recent years because of historian Richard Carrier. There actually isn’t much real evidence that Jesus existed but there is a little. Carrier basically ignores or misinterprets this evidence and isn’t well regarded in scholarly circles. His most recent work failed peer review, which he attributes to a conspiracy against him.
“The apostals all existed and their letters are one prove for that.”
We don’t have a single thing that we know were written by the apostiles. They were most likely illiterate anyway. The Bible books Matthew, Mark, Luke and John were written anonymously. Hundreds of years later, the church put names on them.
That’s incorrect. Virtually all scholars agree that Jesus was a real historical figure, based on many non-religious sources.
Of course most of the stories about him are made up, but the scientific consensus is that he existed.
Could also be an amalgamation of multiple people of a particular movement or philosophy. This happens a lot when you adapt a book to a movie, for example and you end up with characters that are a combination of characters from the original text.
Not that many independent sources actually. The best evidence for me is that if he didn’t exist then why make up the ridiculous Roman census Nazareth story?
There are so many sources that there is more evidence for his existence than for any other person living at the time.
This article mentions at least 14 independent sources: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sources_for_the_historicity_of_Jesus
You are of course free to dismiss all of the sources and have your own opinion, that’s perfectly fine, but do acknowledge that you would be going against established scientific consensus.
That evidence seems sufficient. Not sure why you would assume I would dismiss good evidence. I guess that is common, but I am strictly rational as far as I know.
based on many
Yeah I dunno about “many”
Definitely enough for a whole separate Wikipedia article to list them all: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sources_for_the_historicity_of_Jesus
From that article:
The non-Christian sources that are used to study and establish the historicity of Jesus are Josephus (a Jewish historian and commander in Galilee) and Tacitus (a Roman historian and Senator).
So two. Not “many”.
I don’t think he “converted” like that.
You know how the Queen of England never had a drivers license or passport because she’s the one who issues them and it would be silly to give yourself your own passport.
Jesus didn’t convert to Christianity . He was Christianity. It formed around him he didn’t convert.
