Here, and in most leftist spaces, why does Islam always get a pass?

is it because when people picture “muslim” they picture a POC but when they picture “Christian” they picture a straight white man?

  • RoddyStiggs@lemmy.blahaj.zone
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    12 days ago

    You’re a child.

    Spend the next decade listening to people instead of talking.

    Then decide if you want to ask this question again.

  • Leraje@piefed.blahaj.zone
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    12 days ago

    You’re asking individuals why groups might display certain characteristics or opinions?

    So, in my opinion, I could not care less what someone’s religion is - they are entirely welcome to whatever it is they believe, or whatever variant of the parent mythology they believe in respect of Abrahamism. Lots of theistically religious people have made significant contributions to science over the last few hundred years.

    But what I do take issue with and am vocally against is when religions or religious individuals assume that their particular one is the only ‘right’ one and they try and manipulate or outright force those who are not part of that religion to obey their beliefs. This comes in the form of laws and law-making institutions mostly.

    I live in a country where Muslims make up a very low percentage of the population and therefore they have little to no impact on how I choose to live. Christians on the other hand have a very large influence on the laws and institutions where I am so that’s where the majority of my protesting lies when it comes to religions. If the populations were reversed, so would be my protest.

  • Cypressed@lemmy.blahaj.zone
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    12 days ago

    … Depends on your definition of “okay”.

    A maximally “good person” would not consider it OK to criticize someone’s religion, but they may criticize harmful activities that individuals perform, even if such individuals use their religion as an excuse to do harmful things–because it is not about religion, but rather about choices and actions.

    However, I am admittedly not a maximally good person, no matter how much of a cinnamon roll I do wish I could be… And I draw the line a little further into the gray area, in that the thing that gives me pause is not “it’s a religion” but rather “participation in these activities–” this religion in particular “–strongly correlates with specific marginalized demographics.”

    There is a very strong likelihood that dissing islam will also, with proverbial ‘splash damage’, hit people who are also going through a lot of awful shit with government leadership and legislation that somehow manages to STILL be more cruel and more corrupt than a given “global north” or “western” nation state.

    So … It’s just awareness of context.

    Also there is a chilling effect from all the highly publicized incidents where journalists are murdered for saying something that some individuals whom are Muslim do not agree with.

    (although that does not make them look any worse than when israel murders journalists lately…)

    Generally speaking, the normative population of christians (using the broadest possible definition in Literally Anyone Who Prays To Jesus) does not, statistically, suffer nearly as much oppression as muslims.

    So … due to EXTERNALITIES, mocking islam itself, specifically, feels too much like ‘punching down’ for my liking. It is my hypothesis that there are other people hesitating to talk shit for the same or at least similar reasons. Meanwhile, mocking christianity is quite a bit less like ‘punching down’ because the most corrupt, powerful, dastardly sacks of shit on the planet dress themselves up as christians.

    …That said, I do not think anyone has a leg to stand on as far as trying to dictate at other people that they are “allowed” to mock some religions but not others. I for one believe this is a personal choice that one must make for oneself. If you wish it did not happen, the extent of one’s individual influence is to choose not to oneself.

  • Rhynoplaz@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    12 days ago

    I recommend paying more attention to context.

    When Christian nationalism bans all Muslims from airplanes, that’s racist (yeah, I know, religion isn’t a race, but it’s easier to type and hate is hate.) Muslims shouldn’t be treated like that.

    When Israel is mass bombing schools and hospitals, that’s a genocide, Muslims don’t deserve that.

    When a Muslim judge decides that a woman wasnt respectful enough to her husband and should be beheaded, that’s fucked up, fuck Islam.

    I don’t give a fuck what “team” anybody is on. I’m going to speak up against injustice when it happens, and here and now, I see is Christians committing and supporting injustices against others. Until they stop, you’ll keep hearing us point them out.

    • root@lemmy.wtfOP
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      12 days ago

      Protestanism is Heresy, they may claim to be Christians but they are not

      • Rhynoplaz@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        12 days ago

        And with this comment you’ve proven yourself to be just as biased and hateful as the people you are complaining about.

        I understand now, that YOU have no problem insulting millions of people because of their religion, you just don’t like it when they do they same thing back at you.

        • root@lemmy.wtfOP
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          0
          ·
          12 days ago

          how did I insult the people?

          a heresy is just a belief that is so wrong that it breaks the Christian faith

          • Rhynoplaz@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            0
            ·
            12 days ago

            Arrogance.

            “My version of Jesus is the ONLY correct one, and anyone who disagrees is a heretic.”

            I think you’ll get “persecuted” a lot less if you just focused on your own relationship with God, and stopped worrying about other people’s relationships with God.

            • root@lemmy.wtfOP
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              0
              ·
              12 days ago

              if you see someone drinking poison on the street, do you not take the bottle from their hands and call an ambulance?

              • Rhynoplaz@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                0
                ·
                12 days ago

                Assuming it’s a grown ass adult, of course not.

                It’s not my place to decide what other people should be allowed to drink. If the guy is drinking it, maybe he knows something you don’t, maybe that “poison” is actually good for him, maybe he needs it to live.

                Again, arrogance. What makes you so special that you know better than every other single person living on Earth?

                • root@lemmy.wtfOP
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  arrow-up
                  0
                  ·
                  12 days ago

                  for the sake of the metaphor, if someone that you love is going to eat nyquil chicken, you ARE going to stop them right?

                  it would be immoral not to

  • Zwuzelmaus@feddit.org
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    12 days ago

    It’s never okay.

    Regarding Islam, they are famous for hunting and killing such offenders worldwide regardless of any law.

  • GatesMcBalmer@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    12 days ago

    Well I don’t know what to tell you friend. I’m as bathed in the blood as they come and this has not been my experience. Consider Proverbs 11:27

    “Whoever seeks good finds favor, but evil comes to one who searches for it.”

      • Wildmimic@anarchist.nexus
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        12 days ago

        I don’t curse out people who simply believe in something and act like decent human beings regardless of their spiritual alignment.

        I curse out people proselytizing, i curse out people who say others are worth less because of what they believe. If you are in the latter group, feel cursed out by me.

          • NGram@piefed.ca
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            0
            ·
            12 days ago

            I (regrettably) went through your profile and I see no evidence of what you’re claiming in the OP. What I do see, though, is plenty of evidence that you like to make claims without evidence and then annoy people until they start cursing at you. It’s simultaneously very Christian (religion is not based on verifiable evidence) and not very Christian (which preaches tolerance and respect) of you. My advice: lay off on the proselytising and you’ll be better accepted by people who have differing opinions on religion.

            • root@lemmy.wtfOP
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              0
              ·
              12 days ago

              I respect, tolerate and love every single human being.

              But not their sin, or specific sinful/heretical ideogies

              and “religion is not based on verifiable evidence” is false

              Christianity has a lot of evidence and people just like to ignore ALL of it because they would have to stop living a sinful lifestyle and tend to their Spirit and not constantly their flesh

              • Rhynoplaz@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                0
                ·
                12 days ago

                I respect, tolerate and love every single human being.

                This is why the saying “There is no hate as strong as a Christians love.” exists.

                If your “love” is causing people to curse you, maybe you should ask for consent before spewing “love” on people.

      • A_Union_of_Kobolds@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        12 days ago

        A) lemmy is not real life

        B) most lemmy users are from the West where conservatives have been blatantly anti-Muslim for ages. From the perspective of Americans and Europeans, left-wing defense of Islam is about defending our neighbors from hate.

        C) lemmy is extremely atheist, you will find criticism of anything here. Block and move on

        • root@lemmy.wtfOP
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          0
          ·
          12 days ago

          most people here have USbrain, they cant fathom anything outside the US

        • root@lemmy.wtfOP
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          0
          ·
          12 days ago

          a) well this is, after all, asklemmy isnt it?

          b) yeah, I see that a lot, bunch of people from here think “Christians” and “Republicans” mean the same thing (which is absolutely incorrect and factually wrong)

          c) thanks

          • Wildmimic@anarchist.nexus
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            0
            ·
            12 days ago

            Look up the “No true Scotsman”-Fallacy, which absolutely hits the nail on the head when conflating Christian Evangelists and Republicans. Just saying they aren’t real christians doesn’t make them less christian.

        • root@lemmy.wtfOP
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          0
          ·
          12 days ago

          if you try to say ANYTHING related to the Church on Lemmy, youre gonna get 5 types of Comments

          • Pedophiles (???)
          • slur
          • slur
          • I HATE YOU AND DKOEIRJR RUI3O3JOJK
          • Reddit Atheist that crumbles up and calls you a slur when presented with proof
          • Wildmimic@anarchist.nexus
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            0
            ·
            12 days ago

            If you push religious worldviews here on lemmy, you will get laughed out. This is not confined to a single religion, but rather to all of them outside of academic discussions regarding religions, which are often very interesting.

            If you proselytize, you deserve any shit you get thrown your way, because you started throwing shit into the community.

          • CallMeAl (like Alan)@piefed.zip
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            0
            ·
            12 days ago

            Reddit Atheist that crumbles up and calls you a slur when presented with proof

            Please show me the proof. I promise not to call you slurs.

              • CallMeAl (like Alan)@piefed.zip
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                0
                ·
                12 days ago

                So if I understand, this letter only repeats the claim which was told to the doctor who wrote this letter… Which part proves the claim?

                • root@lemmy.wtfOP
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  arrow-up
                  0
                  ·
                  12 days ago

                  the doctor who wrote this letter was the one who studied the host

              • nocturne@slrpnk.net
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                0
                ·
                12 days ago

                When I was later told that the heart tissue was kept in tap water for about a month and transferred to sterile, distilled water for three year

                Doo they have proof of this? Or just two dudes word and pinky promise they are telling the truth?

                • root@lemmy.wtfOP
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  arrow-up
                  0
                  ·
                  12 days ago

                  cardiac tissue cannot grow from contamination via fingertips or tap water unless it is a miracle

                • root@lemmy.wtfOP
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  arrow-up
                  0
                  ·
                  12 days ago

                  even if it was mishandled, you cannot keep human cardiac tissue ALIVE for YEARS just via contamination and a water container

              • Wildmimic@anarchist.nexus
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                0
                ·
                12 days ago

                Hearsay, hearsay and more hearsay. There is no proof that the tissue has been in water, but the inspecting physician has been very adamant that tissue being stored in water for YEARS, regardless of distilled or not, cannot show the blood cells in the sample, because they would have been washed out ages ago. This leaves 4 possibilities:

                • The people bringing in the sample were telling bullshit tales. This is by far the most probable reason.
                • Someone who has reason to make it appear like a miracle has messed with the samples, replacing them. This doesn’t mean the people bringing the samples in don’t think this is authentic, but without a 100% secured chain of custody it cannot be ruled out. There are people who would be able to make a lot of money out of something like this, so this is the second-most probable reason, and would give the people bringing the sample in additional authenticity because they really believe.
                • The physician made MULTIPLE errors while analyzing the sample. We can’t rule this out, but if he is somewhat competent, this is very improbable
                • We see a miracle. As long as the chain of custody over the samples isn’t 100% watertight, as it is in this case, this isn’t even improbable, it is borderline impossible.

                Bring us irrefutable proof (hint: you won’t be able to) that this sample hasn’t been messed with in the years before it landed on that physicians desk.

                • root@lemmy.wtfOP
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  arrow-up
                  0
                  ·
                  12 days ago

                  how can you “mess with” a sample to make LIVING heart tissue appear on it when you are presumably two catholic clergymen with limited resources?

                  Are you suggesting that they performed a vivisection and took out LIVING heart tissue and preserved it for years and managed to keep the WBCs alive?

              • prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                0
                ·
                12 days ago

                For proving Christianity is real.

                That’s like the holy grail. You will become rich and famous.

                What are you waiting for? Go provide your proof to the Nobel Committee.

                Or are you afraid?

                • root@lemmy.wtfOP
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  arrow-up
                  0
                  ·
                  12 days ago

                  Nobel Prize in what?

                  Chemistry? Physics? Theres no Nobel Prize in theology

          • ExLisper@lemmy.curiana.net
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            0
            ·
            12 days ago

            That’s not what I asked. Why do you think it’s OK to use slurs in this situation and not in others? Because of upvotes? Because you reported it and some comments were removed but others weren’t? Because of some written rules?

            Where do you see those discussions? I don’t think I have ever seen people discuss religion on lemmy. We probably follow different communities. What communities are you talking about?

  • Kennystillalive@feddit.org
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    12 days ago

    I’ve never encountered a community of people hating on religion not shitting on Islam as much as other abrahamic religions.

    What can be is that many “western” politicians try to use Christianity to push their agenda, so people shit on this christians harder, because it’s closer and we are often reminded how shitty people are that try to use religion as a weapon.

  • CerebralHawks@lemmy.dbzer0.com
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    12 days ago

    I’m guessing because of the genocides? After the Holocaust, Jews pretty much got a Get Out of Jail Free card for decades to say/do whatever… Judaism doesn’t really recruit though, so this wasn’t really an issue until the Zionist war machine began committing genocide in Palestine. Between that and what happened in China, people are starting to let Muslims get a pass, just because they’re so persecuted.

    I didn’t really think they had a pass since so many of them are being slaughtered.

    Christians haven’t actually been persecuted in ages. The thing is, Christianity is the most evangelical, so they go into other countries and try to convert everyone. Not everyone takes to it well. So when people resist conversion, Christians act persecuted, when no one was threatening them in their homes, but quite the opposite.

    As an Atheist I just wonder why we can’t all just get along.

    • root@lemmy.wtfOP
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      12 days ago

      Christianity is actually persecuted a lot

      and their “rejecting conversion” is most of the times burning down and desecrating Churches alongside murdering innocent Christians

      And “conversion” isnt a bad thing at all

    • root@lemmy.wtfOP
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      12 days ago

      yeah, most people dont see Christianity as persecuted even when it is, because the US is the only country they can think of and Trump masqurades as a “Christian” so he’s ruining the reputation of every single one of the actual Christians, which is probably what he wants because as WWII demonstrated, the Church is one of the last “obstacles” to a dictatorship

  • Lumidaub@feddit.org
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    12 days ago

    Islam doesn’t get a pass, Christianity is just a LOT more relevant in the spaces you move.

    … Wait, we’ve had this conversation.

  • zxqwas@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    12 days ago

    Because the eternal enemy of the far left, the United States, spent the first part of the 2000s at war with Islamists. (And before to a lesser extent due to US support for Israel)

    Both the far right and islamists want to blur the line between islam and islamists in order to push moderate muslims away from the west. The far left being opposed to anything US does will defend it.

    • root@lemmy.wtfOP
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      12 days ago

      Yeah, and the belief that “anything US claims to be, BAD” is incorrect

  • YarrMatey@lemmy.dbzer0.com
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    12 days ago

    Do you want to call Muslims slurs? What about engage in antisemitism? What’s the real drama going on with you? I don’t picture straight white cis men when I think of Christianity, I picture hateful republicans.

    • root@lemmy.wtfOP
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      12 days ago

      Please do not picture hateful republicans.

      Pope Leo XIV has condemned Trump’s actions

      • Wildmimic@anarchist.nexus
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        12 days ago

        And a shitton of US pastors said Trump doesn’t go far enough. The “no true scotsman”-fallacy at work.

      • YarrMatey@lemmy.dbzer0.com
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        12 days ago

        Sorry I should have double-checked your account before replying. Anyway, I will continue picturing your hateful religion as hateful.

              • Maeve@kbin.earth
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                0
                ·
                12 days ago

                Trying to make yourself a martyr, when historically, Christianity has been the excuse for wonton death and destruction more than any other religion. Self reflection and facing facts are in order.

                • root@lemmy.wtfOP
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  arrow-up
                  0
                  ·
                  12 days ago

                  If I am to absorb the blame for all the bad things Christians and people claiming to have been Christians, you are to absorb the blame for all the bad things that atheists have done as well?